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× For those who like to push chits.

Talon: Fleet Combat in Defense of Earth

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07 Feb 2016 15:11 - 18 Sep 2016 00:41 #221914 by Cranberries

Michael Barnes wrote: I
In sum, Talon is like a sensible 2016 Toyota with good safety ratings and high gas mileage. Armada is a Ferrari. If you have the wherewithal to get the Ferrari, why would you pick the Toyota?




Last edit: 18 Sep 2016 00:41 by Cranberries.
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07 Feb 2016 16:20 #221920 by Michael Barnes
Certainly not trying to diminish the quality of Talon...or quell interest in it. But the Armada comparison is inevitable and it is worth talking about.

There is another point in this. Armada is a miniatures game, Talon is a more traditional hex and counter game. That's another factor that may swing you one way or another on it.

One thing that Talon is better for, I think, is as a zero commitment, beer and pretzels pew pew space combat game. It's easy enough to teach and get going that it s definitely a good choice in that kind of setting.
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07 Feb 2016 17:29 - 07 Feb 2016 19:13 #221922 by Sagrilarus
Just played my first game of Talon and I'm giving it a solid okay. I was playing solo so things were a little slower. And I kept forgetting my turn markers. There's less housekeeping than in SFB but I still had trouble cracking open shields with authority. Similar to SFB that way, but less tools to work with in this first two-on-two scenario.

I really want to see more interesting scenarios. Haven't read all of them but the early ones appear to announce a couple of ship names and that's it. I'd like to see more mix up, wider array of sizes and conditions in a single scenario. Need to read the book more though, as they may be there later.

Don't touch the chits with your hands, at least not the writable area. I used a finger to clear the six boxes for a weapon in one swoop, then couldn't remark them because (I'm assuming) of skin oil on the chit. Polish chits before playing, keep your hands off.

One of my two pens was DOA. Minor quibble.

I need to play this with an opponent, and with dice that don't only roll ones. I had a devil of a time doing damage, even at point blank range. Another brain at the table would certainly mix things up.
Last edit: 07 Feb 2016 19:13 by Sagrilarus.
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08 Feb 2016 12:28 #221973 by Josh Look
I played a solo game before Al and Jeff came over to get the rules down and it's no way to play the game. It works and all, but you miss out on a whole lot. There's a lot of fun to be had in surprise maneuvers and well-timed bids for initiative, and you totally miss that in solo.

Towards the end of the game I had with Jeff and Al I starting to see there was quite a bit of depth in such a simple system, didn't see that at all in solo.
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08 Feb 2016 12:50 #221977 by Sagrilarus
Yeah, I didn't want to ding it too hard until I get a chance to play a couple of games against real live humans. You don't manage to surprise yourself very often. I've put my son on notice that he needs to read the rules and play it with me this coming week.

The Overdrive/Battery thing in off-number impulses seems like a pretty intense part of the game all on its own. Mastering impulse E when nothing normally happens could be a big factor. Alas, the two times I made good use of it I rolled 1s, which more or less meant I discharged my weapons (which take a while to spin back up) and didn't do jack to my opponent's shields or ships.
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09 Feb 2016 11:14 #222063 by Michael Barnes
I think solos OK, but yes, it is one where having a live player makes a difference...you don't know if they're going to go all in on the alpha strike and unload all their disruptor banks or play conservatively...and you never know how they're going to coordinate their maneuvers for prime firing arcs and so forth.

I am leaning more towards "good" and not "great though...you pointed out that there are periods of the game where it feels like not much is happening, and that is something I noticed too...it's not really the case, you are still making action choices after that first salvo and into the turnaround, but compared (once again) to Armada, you're always making decisions a couple of turns ahead- shifting shield power, effecting repairs, coordinating squadrons, considering thrust versus yaw.

But here again, Talon is just a simpler game.

I really don't like the fighters. I strongly dislike how they act just like caps but with different power/movement ranges. But once again, that's coming from Armada. In that game, fighters play very specific, differentiated roles. A-wings are your nimble first strikers, Y-Wings are your bombers, B-Wings are heavy support fighters, and X-Wings are your all-purpose air superiority ships. Talon- only one side even has fighters and they're all just fighters. They also don't intercept or "pin" and caps can pretty much just shoot them with any of their armaments. In Armada, ships have specific anti-fighter weapons so that you aren't just blasting them with the main guns.

The scenarios are bad. They just aren't very interesting. The ship names, if you haven't noticed yet, don't actually matter. Every ship in a class is identical.

Recharging is such a pain in the ass...but in a good way! I do like the power management.
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09 Feb 2016 11:39 #222065 by Sagrilarus
Yeah, if I stick with this the scenarios need to be replaced. Half repaired ships where your opponent doesn't know what works and what doesn't, more lopsided scenarios where one team's job is to survive long enough to boost out of the action, hold until reinforcements show up. Should be easy enough to do, surprised such things weren't in the box.

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20 Feb 2016 19:38 #222908 by Sagrilarus
My second go-round with Talon was MUCH more interesting. The energy/impulse thing is one great big part of the game, and I was much better at it the second time. Scenario 3 is far more interesting too. A great set of ships, with missiles in play.

S.
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17 Mar 2016 08:07 #224514 by Sagrilarus
Sold out again at Cool Stuff Inc. They showed 20+ copies two days ago, and put a limit of one copy per customer. Miniature Market has not restocked again, but I'll wager they'll have some soon since the distributors just grabbed 500 from GMT.
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17 Sep 2016 07:49 #234470 by Gary Sax
www.gmtgames.com/s-2-p500.aspx

Big ship expansion and it looks like random scenario generator just went up on GMT's P500.
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14 Feb 2017 18:23 #243966 by Sagrilarus
Talon 1000 is due to print anytime now, a mere $23. Quite a grab for the price. If you're interested I wouldn't wait, the reprint of the original will very likely clean this one out.

www.gmtgames.com/p-606-talon-1000.aspx

S.
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14 Feb 2017 21:49 #243974 by Gary Sax
...and it takes an agonizingly long time for reprints to happen of even popular GMT stuff.

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16 Feb 2017 12:58 #244044 by jpat
I actually don't see Talon 1000 on the most recent print schedule for this year. Talon's up for a reprint in July, though, so maybe they'd combine the production.

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04 Feb 2018 17:19 #262810 by Gary Sax
Been looking at the rules bump. I think the approach in Talon 1000 to making a solo AI is cool. The designer is making an entirely new faction that IS an AI faction meant to have a minimum of choices. That's cool thematically, I think it's the same thing he's doing in Space Empires. It's nice ce bc he doesn't have to retrofit a sensible AI into sides that are balanced to gave human players a la COIN.
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05 Feb 2018 16:41 #262892 by Gary Sax
Just read the rules. As Sag suggested, they are absolutely dead simple.

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