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Bugs: Recent Topics Paging, Uploading Images & Preview (11 Dec 2020)

Recent Topics paging, uploading images and preview bugs require a patch which has not yet been released.

× Talk about Eurogames here.

Starfarers of Catan

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18 Feb 2008 23:38 #2945 by mikoyan
Starfarers of Catan was created by mikoyan
Went over to a friend's house Saturday night and we played Starfarers of Catan. It was the first time I had played in a longtime. I had a blast playing it although like other Catan games, you can go through long streaks where you can't do anything but those times where you get resources makes the game a blast. The event cards add a bit more to the roleplaying aspect of the game. You actually feel like an exploring going out into space.

Anyways, I think the trading makes the Catan games. Because there are only so many spots that produce resources so it forces you to interact with other players. Blocking players from making other actions is not interaction, that's just being a dick. Trading is a way that you can actually influence actions and what not.

Fun game. I ended up buying it.

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19 Feb 2008 01:09 #2950 by BigLizard
Replied by BigLizard on topic Re:Starfarers of Catan
I have to disagree with you on the trading, but only because I'm awful at it and usually come away with less benefit than the other guy gets from me.

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19 Feb 2008 01:20 #2951 by mikoyan
Replied by mikoyan on topic Re:Starfarers of Catan
BigLizard wrote:

I have to disagree with you on the trading, but only because I'm awful at it and usually come away with less benefit than the other guy gets from me.

but it adds another dimension that the Euroy games don't have. I mean, I should be able to trade corn for something else in Puerto Rico, or whatever. That makes the Catan games less of Multiplayer Solitaire. Not to mention, when rolling the 7, you can steal from someone else.

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19 Feb 2008 09:34 #2963 by Michael Barnes
Robert and I have talked about this a couple of times, how Euro designers have gone completely away from interplayer trading- BOHNANZA and TRADERS OF GENOA are other examples where player interaction through trade is critical. Now, it seems that designers are content to have players trading with the board or with other mechanics rather than with other players, which isn't as fun or interesting as trading with others.

STARFARERS is pretty good. I don't think it's nearly as good as C&K or even STONE AGE but it's a nice change of pace if you want to do SETTLERS with some different things going on. The 5-6 player expansion is worth having too, it adds new aliens. Also make sure you get the soft plastic rings from Mayfair to protect those oh-so-fragile dildoships.

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19 Feb 2008 10:12 #2966 by mikelawson
Replied by mikelawson on topic Re:Starfarers of Catan
I think that trading becomes more of an issue when you have 4 players in a Catan game versus 3. In a 3 player game, the concept of not needing to trade to get all of your resources is more viable, but in a 4 player game there's simply too little available space for a player. A 4 player game in effect forces people to trade.

If people are forced to trade for resources, we tend to get better at it with practice. For example, when I tried playing Settlers on a PC in a 4 player game after tons of 3 player games, I found that my trading sucked. My conclusion was that I need more practice trading. Maybe the smart move is to start trading whether you need it or not, to get you into that "trade first" mode that the wheeler dealers have.

--Mike L.

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19 Feb 2008 10:18 #2967 by Michael Barnes
I think that trading really demands a level of codependency- it's one of the many brilliant things about CIVILIZATION and MARE NOSTRUM for that matter. You _can't_ produce everything so you have no choice but to cooperate. It's the tiniest flaw in the utter perfection that is SETTLERS...that you can feasibly not trade with anyone and still win. Because it's possible to build on all resources and you can trade with the bank that level of codependency is somewhat diminished. OK, thinking about it it's not really a flaw, but I just like that you have no choice but to trade.

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19 Feb 2008 10:33 #2968 by mikoyan
Replied by mikoyan on topic Re:Starfarers of Catan
Michael Barnes wrote:

Robert and I have talked about this a couple of times, how Euro designers have gone completely away from interplayer trading- BOHNANZA and TRADERS OF GENOA are other examples where player interaction through trade is critical. Now, it seems that designers are content to have players trading with the board or with other mechanics rather than with other players, which isn't as fun or interesting as trading with others.

STARFARERS is pretty good. I don't think it's nearly as good as C&K or even STONE AGE but it's a nice change of pace if you want to do SETTLERS with some different things going on. The 5-6 player expansion is worth having too, it adds new aliens. Also make sure you get the soft plastic rings from Mayfair to protect those oh-so-fragile dildoships.

My copy came with those. The boosters slipped on pretty easily. I was kind of bummed though as I had to glue one of the rings and the pointy thing on the end of one of my ships. Not sure what kind of plastic they used, but they should have thought about it a little more since you have to snap parts on the ships.

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19 Feb 2008 10:35 #2970 by mikoyan
Replied by mikoyan on topic Re:Starfarers of Catan
Michael Barnes wrote:

I think that trading really demands a level of codependency- it's one of the many brilliant things about CIVILIZATION and MARE NOSTRUM for that matter. You _can't_ produce everything so you have no choice but to cooperate. It's the tiniest flaw in the utter perfection that is SETTLERS...that you can feasibly not trade with anyone and still win. Because it's possible to build on all resources and you can trade with the bank that level of codependency is somewhat diminished. OK, thinking about it it's not really a flaw, but I just like that you have no choice but to trade.

Soemtimes it's better to trade though. Especially when you need that 1 resource and you need the other resource that was going to be part of the 3 or 4 that you would trade to the bank.

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19 Feb 2008 13:32 #2986 by dave
Replied by dave on topic Re:Starfarers of Catan
"Anyways, I think the trading makes the Catan games."

My one beef with Starfarers is that trading is less critical than it is in other Catan games: The trade ratio is more favorable; many resources can be spent by themselves; players tend to have the same resources, especially near the beginning.

Starfarers is my favorite Catan variant, because of the setting and variety of strategies. However, as with most Catan games, it does have it's share of runaway leader games (and the lesser need for trading aggravates that, as that is the main way to curb a leader in Catan).

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20 Feb 2008 02:12 #3039 by mikoyan
Replied by mikoyan on topic Re:Starfarers of Catan
dave wrote:

"Anyways, I think the trading makes the Catan games."

My one beef with Starfarers is that trading is less critical than it is in other Catan games: The trade ratio is more favorable; many resources can be spent by themselves; players tend to have the same resources, especially near the beginning.

Starfarers is my favorite Catan variant, because of the setting and variety of strategies. However, as with most Catan games, it does have it's share of runaway leader games (and the lesser need for trading aggravates that, as that is the main way to curb a leader in Catan).

We played with the random number placement, it seemed like that made some of the more critical resources more rare.

I don't mind runaway leaders so much especially since there are ways to deal with that.

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