Games Workshop - Dread Fleet

Total personal rant from a former long time GW gamer.

F GW and F this game.

1) Those of you hoping for MoW. Ain't going to happen. If you've actually played it, you know that it's contains a ton of chits and overhead. Personally, I love those type of systems in games where you're keeping track of damage, functions, etc on vehicles and units. Modern gamers...not so much. GW dropped that stuff when they released BFG over 10 years ago. I doubt they'll go back to it. So, this'll be a new system.

2) The designers of MoW have gone on record saying that there were some bits they should have left out. Such as the skaven fleet. Granted, it's fun, but thematically a bit silly... underground dwelling rats making boats? However, this new theme seems to be just as lame if not more. Pirate vampires? Give me a break. Guess it's a way to cash in on a few recent crazes though.

3) Wanna play a fantasy naval game? Go play Uncharted Seas. Where's this level of excitement for that? It's like the Games Workshop logo is a seal of approval or something. Go support the Grindhouses and the Spartan Games of the world. Guys who are making these sort of games with passion. GW is so sterile and emotionless at this point, I miss the days when they were a company run by gamers that where pounding beers and rocking to Bolt Thrower (love that reference) and White Dwarf actually had content.

4) $150. This'll likely have the 'Space Hulk Affect' on boardgame pricing. Minis gamers are used to spending a mint on their games, so they'll have no problem dropping this sort of cash. Unfortunately, boardgame companies may think that gamers as a whole are into this level of cost, and it's likely that we'll see a few games creep over $100...when they shouldn't. Hey, this isn't a matter of affording something or not, but of value. Unless, y'all are cool with paying higher than necessary prices.

5) I'm amazed how GW can continue to abuse it's fans, yet they willing line up for more. The most abusive relationship in gaming. No doubt.

F GW.

So what's the best-of-breed in this category?

S.

1) Those of you hoping for MoW. Ain't going to happen.

I'm glad that it won't be MoW. I already have a ton of stuff for that game and it is growing still. I don't need or want a redo of MoW.

2) The designers of MoW have gone on record saying that there were some bits they should have left out.

Don't forget the Chaos Dwarves who if I recall correctly are landlocked and have to move up a waterfall in order to get to the sea!

3) Wanna play a fantasy naval game? Go play Uncharted Seas.

Been there and done that. My days of keeping up with a current and "live" miniature rule set are over. I go for "closed" or complete systems. That's why I've moved towards boardgames and that is why I'm excited for this game - Since it is billed to be a complete and closed game.

So what's the best-of-breed in this category?

S.

For my money, it is still MoW. That said though, it isn't for everyone. The rules have holes and are unclear (Anyone try to work through the DrillaKilla chart?) amd the fleets are not balanced against each other. For me though that is what makes the game fun.

panzerattack wrote: Having said that, I think Finecast is way better than metal (other than the increased cost).

Why's that? I have no experience other than what I've seen online. The negatives I've heard are lots of airbubbles, lots of casting errors and it is flexible. I've also heard that the details are no different to metal once primed. It just looks better in the blister because the matte finish of the FC material looks sharper to the eye than the reflective metal. That's what I've heard at least.

LordVonTush wrote:

panzerattack wrote: Having said that, I think Finecast is way better than metal (other than the increased cost).

Why's that? I have no experience other than what I've seen online. The negatives I've heard are lots of airbubbles, lots of casting errors and it is flexible. I've also heard that the details are no different to metal once primed. It just looks better in the blister because the matte finish of the FC material looks sharper to the eye than the reflective metal. That's what I've heard at least.

I've heard a lot of people on-line complaining about the air bubbles and casting errors but I've not had a problem with any of the finecast models I've bought. I like it because the detail is at least as good as metal but is so much easier to work with - modifying metal miniatures is a pain in the ass, sometimes even glueing them together in their standard configuration can be a chore. Finecast is as easy as plastic.

Jeff White wrote: Total personal rant from a former long time GW gamer.

F GW and F this game.

1) Those of you hoping for MoW. Ain't going to happen. If you've actually played it, you know that it's contains a ton of chits and overhead. Personally, I love those type of systems in games where you're keeping track of damage, functions, etc on vehicles and units. Modern gamers...not so much. GW dropped that stuff when they released BFG over 10 years ago. I doubt they'll go back to it. So, this'll be a new system.

2) The designers of MoW have gone on record saying that there were some bits they should have left out. Such as the skaven fleet. Granted, it's fun, but thematically a bit silly... underground dwelling rats making boats? However, this new theme seems to be just as lame if not more. Pirate vampires? Give me a break. Guess it's a way to cash in on a few recent crazes though.

3) Wanna play a fantasy naval game? Go play Uncharted Seas. Where's this level of excitement for that? It's like the Games Workshop logo is a seal of approval or something. Go support the Grindhouses and the Spartan Games of the world. Guys who are making these sort of games with passion. GW is so sterile and emotionless at this point, I miss the days when they were a company run by gamers that where pounding beers and rocking to Bolt Thrower (love that reference) and White Dwarf actually had content.

4) $150. This'll likely have the 'Space Hulk Affect' on boardgame pricing. Minis gamers are used to spending a mint on their games, so they'll have no problem dropping this sort of cash. Unfortunately, boardgame companies may think that gamers as a whole are into this level of cost, and it's likely that we'll see a few games creep over $100...when they shouldn't. Hey, this isn't a matter of affording something or not, but of value. Unless, y'all are cool with paying higher than necessary prices.

5) I'm amazed how GW can continue to abuse it's fans, yet they willing line up for more. The most abusive relationship in gaming. No doubt.

F GW.

Seems a bit of an explosive rant considering they haven't even announced what this is yet.

If there's no excitement for Uncharted Seas then maybe the people who make that are doing something wrong, unlike Games Workshop.

I'm a fan of Games Workshop and they've never abused me as a fan. I like their stuff and they're very good at releasing more stuff I like so yeah, they get a lot of my pocket money.

I don't really care about the politics of GW or whatever. They're shitbags, we know this. But they also do some really cool stuff that's above and beyond what even FFG can do, from time to time. I'm interested in this because it's a standalone game that doesn't require me to get a bunch of extra stuff. It's one purchase.

I doubt this will have the "Space Hulk" effect, unless FFG starts figuring out a way to pile more needless decks of cards into their boxes to jack up prices and sell card sleeves. At $150, I'm expecting some really nice, probably pretty big ship miniatures. Likely plastic, clip-together jobs (I hope).

I do wonder if this is a board/tile thing or if it requires terrain/blue felt cloth or whatever. If that's the case, I'm likely not going to get it. I need to see a manifest.

Michael Barnes wrote: Some neglected pros and cons:

Pros:
Vampires on a boat
Will be $300 at aftermarket this time next year

Cons:
$150
$150
$150

Just buy two then and sell one in your last ultimate final games sale.

That's a great idea, Schweig, but the problem is that there won't be another sale. The current one is the swan song.

GW Teaser Trailer

I don't know how to embed YouTube clips, but here's the link for GW's Teaser Trailer released today. The voice over leaves something to be desired and is actually a little funny. What I'm hoping is that the ships included are full of all sorts of characters and pretty much are characters in their own right, except being ships.

EDIT: Well, I guess it pops right in there, so I guess I do know how to embed YouTube clips here!

www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/produ...&prodId=prod1350015a

This boxed game contains:

98-page Rulebook
Seascape Gaming Mat
10 Warships
10 Scenic Bases
7 Cog Auxiliaries
1 Dragon Auxiliary
1 Dirigible Auxiliary
7 Islands
5 Shipwreck Pieces
3 Sea Monsters
5 Treasure Tokens
12 Dice
1 Wind Gauge
2 Ship's Wheels
1 Navigation Rod
10 Warship Cards
55 Damage Cards
40 Fate Cards
12 Auxiliary Cards
10 Wound Cards
11 Miscellaneous Cards

Website says $115

panzerattack wrote:
Seems a bit of an explosive rant considering they haven't even announced what this is yet.

That's exactly what it is. I thought I made that clear.

www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/blogPost.jsp?aId=18300007a

...and it looks like it's going to be tough for me to maintain that stance... those pictures look awesome. It's that seascape gaming mat that does it. Perfect!

Still, it's going to be hard for me to get over what GW did to Tom Anders and to all the fans that have kept their specialist games alive over the past decade.

It looks cool, but I wish I knew more about the actual gameplay. Spacehulk had a history I could bank on. With this game I'd be flying blind and at $115, that's not something I'm comfortable doing. Does anyone have something concrete on the rules? Are we talking a re- hash of Battlefleet Gothic or MOW? Or is this a completely new system?


-Will

Says "two (or more) players" and I can see at least 6 armies of the Warhammer World represented there (Empire, Vampire Counts, High Elves, Dark Elves, Dwarves, Skaven) plus some other cool-looking ships with connections I can't really confirm (the one with the two elementals behind the sail has me really intrigued.)

From the sounds of the contents, it's basically a tightened version of Man 'O War, which isn't a bad thing. (Plus, Skaven ship!)

Still haven't found the time to finish putting together my Space Hulk set, which I've had since it launched.

Putting those ships together looks like a nightmare. Pass.