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TOPIC: Let's Talk: 40K

Let's Talk: 40K 21 Nov 2017 21:25 #258023

Had an arranged 40K game today at the store, but then we saw a Necromunda demo copy set out on the table, so we did that instead after a 3-second hesitation.
What I like most about this Necromunda is the alternate activation, and so did the people I played and those who watched.
Actually, I talked to a guy who said he played 40K in his group using the alternate activation instead of IGOYOUGO, and that it mitigated the issue of alpha striking. I'm really interested in giving it a try.
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Let's Talk: 40K 12 Dec 2017 21:53 #259010

So I played my first two games in my newly joined escalation league, my 3rd and 4th game of 8th edition. These were 500 point lists and this is what I ended up going with.

Company Commander
Infantry Squad x3, 2 with Lascannons
Demolisher with 3 H. Bolters
Tempestor Prime w/ Plasma Pistol
Scions w/ Plasma Pistol and Plasma Gun x 2

Game 1 was against Genestealer Cult. They had put over half their points in a close combat super unit that got screwed with their special deployment rules and ended up on the far side of the table away from everything. Cleaned up the rest of his list, eventually the super unit made it into the backfield but by then it was too late. Would've wiped him out on turn 5 but my Demolisher basically wiffed all its rolls. Lost the scions after they dropped into his backfield and 1 infantry squad who took the late game charge of the super unit. MVP - Deep Striking Scions: the 5 man squads hit hard, then die hard... but they hit hard first.

Game 2 was against a Dark Angel list with only 3 units. A squad of 5 termies, a commander in termie armor, and a squad of scouts. He went first and deep struck his termies right in front of my whole army, wanting to charge in and tie up my tank after shooting a lot. He failed the charge and the whole army unloaded on him wiping the termies. Then the terminator commander charged up and hit the scions and failed to finish them... they fell back and the whole army unloaded on the commander killing him. Then the army unloaded on the scouts and killed them. We lost 7 infantry models. MVP - Deep Striking Scions. Overcharged Plasma crushed the termies.

Things learned about 40k. Still very dice heavy (I actually like this) and super important to position models prevent deep strikes, to take charges, and limit follow up moves from tieing up units. There are tactics, but in the end its always gonna be a very beer and pretzels game. I continue to be amazed that there is such a large tourney/competitive scene for a game with rules like this.

Guard: I thought my basic infantry squads were awesome and fun to run up the field dying as they went. I've always leaned toward including heavy weapons teams... but I think the basic 40 point squad of just lasguns is more important to how I play guard, throwing bodies around! Order system is great fun! Hot dice make a guard army VERY strong.

I had a blast, my opponents were great teachers and made it fun. Looking forward to what 750 point games bring. Here's what likely will be my list.

Company Commander
Tank Commander Punisher w/ 3 H. Bolters and Storm Bolter
3 Infantry Squads
Demolisher w/ 3 Heavy Bolters
Tempestor Prime w/ Rod
5 man Scion w/ Plasma Pistol and Plasma x2
5 man Scion w/ Plasma Pistol and Plasma x2
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Let's Talk: 40K 13 Dec 2017 21:11 #259070

Game 2 sounds incredibly satisfying.
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Let's Talk: 40K 13 Dec 2017 21:55 #259071

Yeah, you know, when you cut through all of the folderol, 40k really is a beer and pretzels game. It's _silly_ as hell, and when it is at its best is when it is slightly off the hinges a bit or when the almost impossible becomes possible because of a heroic (or completely blundered) die roll. You can have the best unit on the board and it's alpha striked turn one, so you have to spend the rest of the game figuring out what the hell to do. If you can't laugh at the capriciousness of not rolling anything 4 up on 20 dice, then 40k is not for you.

It is funny that it's such a competitive, SERIOUS thing for some people. I don't get it. But play at those SERIOUS levels and you see a very different game. It becomes about list abuse, spamming especially effective units and exploiting the iffier rules. I think it says a lot that you can run a list consisting of Magnus and a horde of Brimstone Horrors and _win tournaments_...and what it says is "it ain't that serious chief". There are a TON of units and even factions that the SERIOUS players never touch, and if you look online you can see all kinds of Mathhammer stuff determining if units are competitive or not competitive. But there again, I don't really give a shit. When I put my Eldar army together, I didn't really care that I wasn't bringing in the top Craftworld units. I specifically wanted to do a highly mobile Saim-Hann force strictly consisting of bikes, tanks, and a little air support. Nothing touching the ground. I _should_ run a couple of Wave Serpents filled with Wraithguard, Dark Reapers, something like that...but I don't wanna.

Guard is so good this edition...I know you are loving that Punisher, it is a total monster against light units. I put Plasma on the sponsons on mine to make it extra hateful...since I usually play with power levels, the cost isn't an issue. You'd probably really dig a Taurox Prime, it's actually a pretty solid medium tank option. I run mine with the "suboptimal" missile launcher because I thought it looked the coolest and I didn't have anything else that threw giant missiles at stuff.

It also sounds like Conscripts would suit your bodies style. Fast, cheap and out of control lasguns.

I pretty much always take the Heavy Weapon option, there again just because it's cool. Usually Lascannons because they are versatile and powerful. If I have some guardsmen holding down a position or in the backfield, I'll give them a mortar team. Mortars are good.
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Let's Talk: 40K 13 Dec 2017 22:41 #259073

I think it starts getting complex at 1250+ points, with more units&combos to juggle.
I also find that unexperienced players rarely take into account those plasma-powered scions. You absolutely need to deal with deep-striking units, such as creating a bubble around your armored units, use stratagems, whatever. Four plasmas will destroy a dreadnought with one salvo if they manage to get to 12 inches. At 500-750 pts that means game over on turn 1.
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Let's Talk: 40K 02 Mar 2018 08:22 #264359

I received a copy of Dark Imperium in a recent math trade and am excited to put all the models together. Had a brief look through the rulebook and the story over the past few days. This is my first foray into Warhammer, so I am unfamiliar with the system and how to build an army, etc. I will likely just play casually, possibly just build and paint if I can't persuade anyone to give it a go. I don't want to invest too much into the game before assembling my DI box, but what would be the next best step if I wanted to work on expanding my Death Guard from DI? I thought about maybe getting the First Strike box for some extra models, since it's not too pricey.

Also, I would be interested in some form of gaming mat/terrain to play the game on, is the moonbase gaming mat GW released a worthwhile purchase? Thank you!
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Let's Talk: 40K 02 Mar 2018 13:21 #264391

The moon base thing is GREAT. Highly recommended. It comes with a nice set of terrain that is enough to get you started, it’s basically three large boards in a box that gives you a roughly 4x6 play are. It also has three scenarios.

Expanding DG- the First Strike box is an excellent way to expand both sides, as are the other “Easy to Build” kits. They all are designed specifically to complement Dark Imperium. For example, the DI box gives you 7 Plague Marines...and the ETB kit conveniently gives you 3 more- all different from those in DI. The Myphitic Blight Hauler is a solid add- but if you really play it, you may want a couple more of them.

There are a couple of directions to go with DG, although there really aren’t a lot of models. Which is kind of nice.

The first thing you should do is get the DG codex. It expands on all the lore and stories, and it has lots of game content including the stratagems, psyker disciplines, and artifacts. This may help guide where you want to go with them. It also includes all unit data sheets, so you can look at load out options.

If you like the Poxwalkers, step one is to double them. Either get 4 ETB kits or buy a set on eBay that someone parted out from DI. 40 is kind of a minimum. Then, you pretty much have to have Typhus- he gives them some valuable buffs.

There are TONS of choices for Plague Marines, the multipose kit is REALLY good. I have three 7 man squads- one is all ranged stuff, one is straight melee, and the other is a mix.i also can flex and go to 10 man squads or mix and match.

Blightlord Terminators are kind of a signature DG unit and they definitely embody the lurching, lumbering and hard as hell to kill nature of DG. But the kit is very expensive. I would advise one box and then the new ETB set that came out, and treat them strictly as elites.

Deathshroud Terminators are different. Their kit is even more expensive because you only get 3. They look awesome, armed with scythes. But they are really intended to be bodyguards for the DG Primarch Mortarion, so pass on them unless you want to get Morty ($125, but pretty amazing).

As for new armor kits, other than the ETB Blight Hauler, your only choice is the Plagueburst Crawler. Basically a big mortar with some Tanky weapons bolted on it. It’s a terrific kit. I had to get two.

Then there are characters, like the previously mentioned Typhus. I would say avoid these unless you are sure that you want them- they are all really cool, highly specialized, and expensive- $22-$30 per figure. You can always proxy them to see if you like what they do.

There are also legacy models you can get to fill in some roles. I think you really, really want at least a pair of Chaos Rhinos- these are transports. You can load them up with Poxwalkers and they’ll last a lot longer. They are fairly inexpensive- $33 on eBay. They are also pretty fun to build and paint.

You can also go out with Predators and Land Raiders if you want more tanks.

There are a few other things you can get, like a Hellbrute...but I think you can largely stick to the new kits.

And then there are Daemons...you can bring in Nurgle Daemons if you are so inclined but that’s a whole other thing.
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Let's Talk: 40K 02 Mar 2018 14:01 #264397

Michael, thank you for the incredibly detailed and informative response! I may pick up the terrain set, First Strike and the codex today after work (a little "end of the week" treat) and create want list based on all your information. The Mortarion model is absolutely amazing... one of the coolest looking models I've seen. Tempting as hell to get... tax return is coming soon.. so.... who knows?

I may explore e-bay at some point and try to file the ranks with some PM and Poxwalkers, and when I win the lottery, probably get some of those awesome Plagueburst Crawlers/Bloat Drones... really lots of options, even with fewer models as you say. Very excited to give this game a shot.

I appreciate the advice, and hope that other people reading your post will benefit as I am!
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Let's Talk: 40K 02 Mar 2018 14:24 #264399

Oh yeah, the Bloat Drones...GREAT piece. I have two of the DI ones, I didn’t get the kit. The kit had two additional weapon options, one is a Flesh Mower, which is pretty much exactly what you are thinking. The other is a Blight Launcher. You can buy a DI Drone for about $20 on EBay, the kit is like $45. So if you don’t care about changing the weapon...don’t bother with the kit. I like the two I have with the Plague Spitters- it’s kind of a medium range flamer that benefits from the Plague Weapon trait.

Mortarion is awesome, and he’s fun to play with...but I haven’t even painted him yet. It’s pretty intimidating.

BTW- most DG painting is pretty easy, really. You will DEFINITELY want to invest in a can of Death Guard Green spray. Prime with it. It will reduce your work time on them by many hours. You basically spray them, then work the details, and then Agrax Earthshade. A highlight round after that dries and you are pretty much done if you are only going for tabletop quality. Of course, the sky’s the limit on these models.

Do be advised that Moonbase Klasius isn’t quite enough terrain in the long run. For now, in early games like the scenarios it comes with, it doesn’t matter. But you may want more later. It could be as simple as buying another set of the Ryza ruins that come in that set (only like $28 I think).

One of the cool things about First Strike is that it actually has a little paper play mat and the box doubles as terrain. So you could even play your first games with just that set, and it does have a few scenarios in that box.
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Let's Talk: 40K 03 Mar 2018 05:34 #264416

I picked up the Moon Base (probably get more terrain as you say, what comes in it doesn't seem close to enough terrain.. wonder if Necromunda terrain would match), Codex and a can of Death Guard Green + a textured paint for the DG bases. I was VERY tempted to get First Strike or the three Plague Marine ETB set... but I had to put a limit for now. Next pay cheque I will grab a few more units! The Moon Base is seriously heavy, I got some stares in the subway with my giant Warhammer Bag haha. Also got some cool free prints from the first year anniversary of the store I shop at, which is kind of neat... Maybe put some above the bedroom headboard and see what the miss thinks!
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Let's Talk: 40K 17 Aug 2018 14:08 #279994

When I decided recently to get back into 40k I dove in on DG. I picked up all the cool looking models I wanted to see on the table creating havoc. I've read all over the web that you shouldn't use this and shouldn't use that but that's just stupid because 40k isn't a great tactical game. Ever since my first play back in the 80's I realized you could game the system. That's no fun. I'll take my chaos spawn charging in with plague marines any day over whatever spam option is best.
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Let's Talk: 40K 17 Aug 2018 14:54 #279997

Ha ha, Chaos Spawn are terrible! I have a couple mostly because Lords of Change can make them and I think they are funny.

DG is awesome, they have some of the best models and they are bad ass. Make sure you get at least one of the Plague Marine kits- it’s super fun, lots of customization. I have a shooty set and a CC set- that plague flail man. They also have a few fun characters with cool abilities- like the Biologus Putrifier. Plagueburst Crawlers are one of my favorite tanks on the game, basically a coehorn mortar on treads. Blight Drones are wicked. If you want to do the zombie thing, Typhus and at least 40 Poxwalkers are a must.

Oh, and get the Feculent Gnarlmaw..it’s super cool. It’s like a rotten vagina tree with caviar inside it and bells hanging all over it.
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Let's Talk: 40K 18 Aug 2018 07:54 #280018

I bought all of the DG PM sets and used extra bits to kitbash. I kitbashed a set of possessed because those models are awefuly aged. I used the extra breast plates from the PM set and heads from plague bearers as well as some bits from the spawn kits.

The new models are so cool in comparison to the old ones it is very exciting now to see the new releases. The old chaos marine sets look like kids toys next to the new sets.
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