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Hearthstone Players! 12 Jan 2018 02:10 #260762

Jackwraith wrote:
I like it, but I lack Zola, Elise, and Herald Volazj. Who the fuck keeps Herald Volazj for the past year-and-a-half?

Me. I still run it in control priest, because swapping health with deathlords and dirty rats is fun.
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Hearthstone Players! 12 Jan 2018 07:06 #260765

You're thinking Vol'jin, the troll, not Volazj, the demon. I would totally play Vol'jin if he were still in Standard. Volazj is the one who creates 1/1 copies of each of your other minions. That would see some use in the current meta for Radiant Elementals or maybe Grand Archivists if you wanted to cast multiple big spells in the same turn, but Priest minions are largely Battlecry driven and don't have a ton of passive effects. You could always have multiple Clerics, but if you're a smart Priest player, you never go full Cleric. Too much chance of overdrawing or hitting fatigue too fast. Plus, with the prevalence of aggro Paladin, Voidwalkers, and tempo Rogue's weenies, there are so many board clears in regular play that having 1/1s of your other guys would last about a turn. I've never quite understood what their intent was for the card, but it's never manifested and he's going to rotate to Wild without ever seeing regular play (and probably won't there, either.)
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Hearthstone Players! 12 Jan 2018 08:20 #260776

Herald Volazj interacts with the Quest, which just needs Summons. I think that was the game plan. Was it in the same set as Tortollan Shellraiser The 2.6? Because that's the best interaction, by far. Even then it was kind of weak. Priests, for the most part, can't count on stuff sticking around, because the opponent knows the Healing power makes anything that sticks super obnoxious. so the chances that you can have a decent 3 dude board to Volazj are really low.

Mostly it's used in memes, like copying Malygos for +10 Spell Damage and big Mind Blasts and junk like that.
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Hearthstone Players! 12 Jan 2018 08:47 #260779

Vol'jin is a great card and it's one of two - the other being Injured Blademaster - that comes to mind when one considers which cards to permanently add to the Priest core set. As far as power level of the class legendaries goes, I'd put it somewhere between Grommash and Tirion and I think you could easily sub Velen out for him without breaking the game.

Also, I was wrong about Rin. I thought she was a meme card but it's shocking how often you can summon Azari. She's not top tier but at least decks that support her are relatively consistent and make sense. It's not like you're trying to make chicken salad out of the chicken shit that is Shaman basic totems. I think that's what people want from Team 5 when it comes to design. I don't think anyone was expecting Freeze Shaman to be meta-defining and I would have tried to play a tier three Freeze Shaman (thanks, Moorabi) if it had a few decent cards to support it. That's why I'm so high on Spell/Recruit Hunter right now and I'm hoping they learn from it and quit half-assing new archetypes.

Edit: You could change Vol'jin's battlecry to "Swap health with an enemy minion" if you're worried about Obsidian Statue or other interactions being too powerful.
Last Edit: 12 Jan 2018 08:54 by SebastianBludd.
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Hearthstone Players! 12 Jan 2018 15:51 #260808

Volazj was Whispers. Shellraiser was Un'Goro, so she was definitely intended to go with the Quest. He may have been as well and they might have just stuck him in as the "Priest legendary" in Whispers because another card didn't work out and they thought they'd see how he was played before the real reason for his inclusion became apparent in the next set. They've done that before. But he didn't work out, either.

If they included Vol'jin in the Priest base set... I'll be in my bunk. I think everyone was wrong about Rin. Some site did a poll before Kobolds was released and she was rated the third-worst card in the set. Now, of course, she's a thing because the meta slowed down even more than it had with Un'Goro. I totally agree with your design speculation. I would also have played Freeze Shaman if most of the cards they included weren't such utter trash. Brrloc is one of the best Murlocs ever and Voodoo Hexxer is a solid Arena card, but Cryostasis is the definition of a meme epic card. You can either make one of your minions an utter target and useless for a turn or you can take three more damage to the face to eliminate an enemy minion with your 3-cost 1/3 weapon. Avalanche is a perfect example of a card waiting for the perfect situation. If your opponent isn't smart enough to avoid placement that sets up cards like Betrayal, you can wipe out a couple weenies while... waiting a turn to draw Hex so you can really get rid of that Arcane Giant you wanted to remove...? Maybe you're playing that because it's turn 10 and you've just played Moorabi for the one turn he's going to live so you can get your own Arcane Giant? Awesome play, yo. If he'd been a 5/5, maybe- MAYBE -you could justify his slot in a freeze deck, but only maybe. JFC, Grumble is a 7/7 for the same cost and he has a ton more utility than Moorabi does. He's certainly no slower, even while he bounces your whole board.

And, of course, the worst thing is that after spending 5 of Shaman's 10 slots on those awful cards and two more on Drakkari Defender and Snowfall Giant (Everyone loves Overload! The two or three Overload decks I've seen for the spellstone don't even use those two cards...), they didn't even follow up in Kobolds. No freeze cards whatsoever. That has to be their biggest design fail in quite some time.
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Hearthstone Players! 12 Jan 2018 19:31 #260815

Just to continue the rant (because that's, like, what I do here in this shithole for stable geniuses. What? That's another rant? Sorry.), let's look at Shaman for the last two sets:

Knights: Brrloc, Ice Fishing, Drakkari Defender, Ice Breaker, Avalanche, Voodoo Hexxer, Cryostasis, Snowfury Giant, Thrall Deathseer, Moorabi

Brrloc, as noted, is one of the best Murlocs ever made, largely because Murlocs are a multiplicative tribe and Brrloc often ensures that key Murlocs (Warleader) will be preserved to multiply others. Ice Fishing is an enabler for Murlocs and I use two in my Frog deck that I no longer try to play on ladder because Murlocs outside of Paladin kinda suck, except for the memes. Defender, Ice Breaker, Avalanche, Cryostasis, Snowfury, and Moorabi are complete ass as detailed earlier. You may be able to make an argument for Avalanche at some point in the future if they find a way to synergize with other cards. I play one Defender in my Guild Recruiter deck because Recruiter grabs it without its unplayable drawback and/or there's occasionally a way to survive into the later turns of a game you'll still lose, but which will let you fulfill more steps of a quest you're trying to finish. Until they reprint Tunnel Trogg, Snowfury will never be good. Moorabi is horrible even if its stats weren't already brutal. It currently stands as the worst of the trash legendaries that have emerged in the last two sets. Deathseer is a staple in Evolve decks. Yay?

Kobolds: Crushing Hand, Kobold Hermit, Healing Rain, Murmuring Elemental, Primal Talismans, Lesser Sapphire Spellstone, Unstable Evolution, Windshear Stormcaller, Grumble Worldshaker, The Runespear

Crushing Hand is usable only in an Overload deck and who would play that? (Well, Zalae did in an HCT event recently and bombed out in the first round. Surprised?) Why wouldn't you just play Hex if you want something gone and you'll still have 5 mana next turn? Playing Hand is going to cost you 5 mana, regardless. Hermit is possibly playable if Totem decks are ever a thing. Outlook here is grim. Healing Rain is a great control Shaman card. Murmuring Elemental is solid for Elemental decks, which are still not viable in either Shaman or Mage. Primal Talismans is fucking awful even in Totem decks. Sapphire is the worst of all of the Spellstones, mostly because it requires you to use the worst mechanic in the game.

Tangent: The worst thing about Sapphire Spellstone is its cost. What it means is that, even if you get it charged up, you'll often be in a situation in which you can't use it even on the turn you activate it. What's the best possible minion to use in a deck with Sapphire? Earth Elemental, of course. EE costs 5. Sapphire costs 7. So, EE activates Spellstone by itself... but their combined cost is 12, which means you'll have to cast EE and then do something else, because you can't use your Spellstone on the same turn unless you happen to have two Coins in hand. So just wait until your opponent plays Hoarding Dragon, Timmy! Then you're golden! So your EE somehow survives until the next turn, but he's Overloaded you for three. Which means you STILL can't play Sapphire Spellstone unless it's turn 10 or beyond! But then that means the ONLY thing you can do on this turn 10 or beyond is play your Spellstone. Hey, it's giving you two more EEs, right? They, of course, will only have the 2 or 3 life that your original EE has left (Remember, you can't heal them in any way because the only thing you can do this turn is play the Spellstone.), which means that a simple Hellfire will likely erase all of them. Unreal.

Unstable Evolution, in complete contrast to all of this shit, is a great spell and enables not just Evolve decks, but also cards like Arcane Giant. The latter will be rotating out of Standard in a couple months. Have fun! Windshear Stormcaller doesn't really have that name. Its actual name is Meme Epic and will be referred to as such from this day forth. I played one once. Just once. The Al'Akir it got for "free" couldn't even get through the Arena-level taunt that my opponent (Jeb!) had played. In contrast, I spent 1 mana for an Unstable Evolution to change a Corridor Creeper into Al'Akir the other day and it did some work. This is, again, in complete contrast to spending 5 for a vanilla 5/5 and trying to keep all 4 vanilla totems on the board. Grumble is overstatted, has an interesting effect, and would be a great card in any deck but Elementals, which are still too slow and too dependent on what you played last turn to be usable. They're a combo deck that's trying to be a midrange deck. Fail. He still might see play in other decks that have a ton of Battlecries, but it's unfortunate that his intended deck simply won't work on the ladder. The Runespear is the worst of the non-playable weapons. Brode's justification for it was: "Shaman doesn't have a lot of targeted spells!"; suggesting that spending 8 on a 3/3 weapon would mean it's OK that damaging your face 3 times and hoping for 3 purely RNG effects to go in your favor is somehow worth 1600 dust. Ell Oh Ell?

Shaman since August 2017, ladies and gentlemen.
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Hearthstone Players! 14 Jan 2018 18:43 #260946

Jackwraith wrote:
Shaman since August 2017, ladies and gentlemen.
I think Shaman since August 2017 can be laid upon the altar Shaman since August 2015 when Tuskarr Totemic and Totem Golem came out and fucked everyone to death with their awesomeness. Coupled with Tunnel Trogg in November of that year and Shaman was the #1 Hero and nothing was close. They nerfed Totemic, Rockbiter, and Abusive Sergeant in one go to try and tame things in Sept 2016. They've been trying to handle that ever since. We finally see Hunter emerge from the nerf shadow laid on it in the wake of Undertaker/Face after Naxx came out. Shaman will come back to life in another couple of sets I would gather.
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Hearthstone Players! 14 Jan 2018 21:51 #260952

I remember when Tuskarr Totemic was previewed. "THREE MANA FOR A 3/2?!!!" Shaman was awful then (basically zero presence in Ranked and was often the only class left out of pro events) and people (including me) couldn't believe how underpowered the card seemed. That was a general feeling about all of TGT in comparison to GVG and the base sets but, even so, this seemed bad because people looked at the card and the only thing they thought of was basic totems. On turn 3, a vanilla 3/2 and a basic totem meant jack-all in the face of what was coming from your opponent on his next turn.

But then people started playing it and summoning Flametongues and Mana Tides and what became drawing the nuts: Totem Golem. Three mana for a 3/2 and a 3/4? OK. So, yeah, Shaman promptly went out of control. I think they've learned a lot since then, but they still don't seem to think that an RNG hero power is a problem. Or that it's the only power in the game that can be capped in use. Unless they release a bunch of new totems that do pretty amazing shit, their totem decks will be as successful as Overload decks.

And I'm fine with class rotation. Priest is king right now after suffering at the bottom for pretty much the entirety of the game, except the point in the beta when SWD got added and Mind Control still cost 8. But what I don't want is for some classes to be king and others to be either useless or restricted to one deck type, which is the case for Shaman at the moment. As I was ranting about earlier, if they had created decent Frozen cards, there would at least be a deck that could feasibly be played instead of Evolve. Since Evolve is ruled by RNG, no one plays Shaman right now, except those of us puttering around with unworkable ideas in the nether reaches. I don't mind some classes being down while others are up. I just don't want one or two classes to simply not be competitive, which is the case for Shaman right now.
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Hearthstone Players! 17 Jan 2018 23:32 #261298

Time to dominate the thread again. I hit level 15, which is usually the point where I feel like I've accomplished something and can then play whatever the hell I want. So I've been hopping around to different decks or non-decks (read: Shaman; even the main streamers are denigrating Shaman these days: Firebat and Trump have both posted videos in the past 48 hours about how Shaman sucks and they were only playing it to finish quests.) But I picked up the Play 30 Priest cards quest, so I decided to play some Big Priest. I don't especially like the deck, because it veers rather wildly between drawing the nuts (i.e. Barnes) and winning by turn 4 or not doing so and having either an interesting game or one where you just have no hope. The purpose of playing it for the quest is that it uses only 4 neutral cards (Barnes, Arthas, Ysera, Y'shaarj) which means I can probably finish the quest in two games.

hsreplay.net/replay/zVJ32ZKiY6vtR4WwsoKqUN

Pretty sure this was just a control Warlock, since I didn't see any Cubes and Cubelock doesn't normally run Homonculus, who shows up early on. I do not draw the nuts by turn 4 and, thus, the game is of interest. My hand for the first few turns is classic Priest: either I can't cast it or it serves no purpose to cast it. Thus, I end up doing classic Priest turn 2 (heal self or heal the full-health opponent.) But by turn 3, I've drawn both Pains, which means I can't use Shadow Visions to find one for the inevitable Voidlord, so I toss one at the Mistress so I get as much benefit from her as he does. His turn 4 Gnomeferatu destroys one of my Greater Healing Potions. And then by turn 5, Homonculus shows up and I know I'm probably not facing Cubelock so Voidlords, while a problem, aren't as much of one, so I SWP the demon to make it tougher to remove whatever Essence gets me next turn. Turn 6 Arthas gives me his famous sword, which is one of the best cards I can get for this deck and I can use it next turn. He clears his board to get rid of him and the advantage is mine with turn 7 Servitude. Deck activated.

Prince Valanar was another surprise, but it also told me that he had no Hellfires, which is generally a positive thing (but weird.) Topdeck 2nd Servitude and Arthas returns for the third time. This is where my opponents usually start to get aggravated, especially since turn 9 almost inevitably means Statue. I toss the Death Grip and play the Voidwalker at least in part to keep my hand moving because this deck is so slow and so frequently gets extra cards that I often overfill my hand and mill stuff. I don't want to do that against another control deck that may require all of my resources. I finally draw Barnesy and figure I'll just SWD the Bonemare and see what I get from the spotlight. It's his turn 9 now and he decides to draw twice and Drain Soul into a smart Defile. I was wondering if his Voidlords were at the bottom of the deck, but he was just trying to preserve them, perhaps with the knowledge that I'd played both Servitudes and both SWPs, so the prospect of removal was less. But I get the high roll on my Spellstone, getting my 4th Arthas and a Statue and no Barnes.

A Voidlord hits and I decide to start playing with my Frostmourne toy. I use the Obliterate to ensure that at least one of my bigger guys will get through next turn to apply some pressure and not waste the whole turn clearing Voidwalkers. Also, it's past turn 10 and if he has Gul'dan, I want to clog his history with Voidwalkers to minimize the chance of a Lord returning. But Arthas gets Siphoned, so I end up clearing anyway, but Essence gets me Ysera, which means more exotic cards (except they're not Priest cards...) Then he goes double Dreadlord and I'm all "Sweet! I'm'a get me a Dreadlord!" Frostmourne spits out the casualties, both 5/5 Ysera and the Statue swing, and I GHP the Statue for the hell of it. The only thing he can do is Voidlord, which I then Dream for lethal.

hsreplay.net/replay/fqaRuHNQpTTv9rhBXs4PU6

Next game was against an actual Cubelock. Once again, I do not draw the nuts (which, y'know, is why I'm telling you about these games in the first place.) He spent the first 4 turns drawing himself down to 22, but I hadn't done anything. So, when he used one of his Dark Pacts to go back up to full, with no threats on the board, I kinda thought Dr VonCrazy was either really crazy or didn't have a ton of experience with his deck. And then when he actually cast Doomguard on turn five, I knew he was crazy. He had to know I'd have answers and he just discarded two cards; one of them a relatively irrelevant Shadow Bolt in this matchup... but the other one, a Cube, being one of his key combo cards! And, of course, I immediately presented an answer in the form of a Coined Essence for 5/5 Statue.

He decides to Cube his DG, which I'm fine with. He can't get through the Statue and the other Essence gives me Ysera, who's going to start giving me cool (non-Priest!) cards. He's already used one Pact, which means the likelihood of him getting rid of the Cube is less. It seems like he's going to grind to a halt. But Coil gives him his two DGs and Siphon removes Ysera. So, his position isn't as bad as I'd thought, since I was thinking I could use Ysera to clear at least one and then Smite away the other 2 health. But topdecked Pint-Size Potion lets SWH do its work and we are at stage: Crisis averted. I'm looking at a Servitude in hand, which means my deck is about to start rolling. He spends turn 8 doing all of Life Tap and I think this game is about to become mine. And then, Arthas arrives. He gives me Doom Pact, which is nice, but is my least favorite of the Lich King cards. I play a control deck. I don't want to sacrifice a quarter of it to get rid of someone's board. Arthas gets Siphoned, but now it's turn 9 and I play my default play followed by his default play. I Visions for SWP to remove the Voidlord and then Servitude for Arthas, since he's more of a threat to the other Voidlord and also applies more offensive pressure than Ysera, in addition to giving me (non-Priest!) cards. He gives me the 2nd-best Arthas card in Anti-Magic Shell.

Then the crazy doctor returns and he double Hellfires to remove Arthas. In the end, it's not that crazy, because otherwise he keeps taking 8 to the face if I can clear his Voidlord. I decide to Anti-Magic Shell the lone Statue to protect it from being removed by a Spellstone. Of course, I forgot to heal it first... But he has nothing left that can do 3 damage and the only thing that can burst is a DG that will do 5, anyway, so I just heal me. Gul'dan appears and a DG takes out the Statue which removes a Voidwalker (never lucky.) So I'm all: "Death Knight, huh? Alllllrighty, then!." Three DGs go away and another SWP removes the Voidlord. Five Voidwalkers are not a terrible threat. Also, it's turn 12 and I'm 5 cards ahead in the fatigue race. His hero power heals him, but mine can do more damage. And, uh, I haven't used either Dragonfire, which he plays right into, while furthering my fatigue lead with a Librarian. By this time, I'd decided that he wasn't crazy. He just isn't that good with Cubelock.

The last Voidlord arrives. SWP removes it. Dragonfire cleans up the trash because I know he only has one Doomguard left and I have SWD in hand. A Lackey comes down and I'm down to 13, but I know there's only a couple particular spells left in my deck and GHP is one of them. Visions gets me one and now I'm 6 points ahead in life and 6 cards ahead in fatigue. Skull comes out, which tells me he has the last DG in hand. I dick around trying to decide if I should burn the Lackey and heal or drop the Statue. I decide on the Statue, since the DG will be coming automatically and this way I can get 8 life back, rather than 4. But he has Spellbreaker! Suddenly, I'm back to 13. But, uh... oh, yeah. You remember Razakus Priest is still the best deck in the game, right? Yeah. His hand is just a bunch of removal. I erase a Lackey and a Mistress and he goes into fatigue and concedes before I can do the morale-crushing Spellstone.

I finally got to 1600 dust the other day and spent it on Val'anyr, since I play Paladin more than Warlock (Skull) and Shaman (Grumble.) I'm having some degree of buyer's remorse, since there always seems to be something better to do at 6 mana in a Call to Arms deck (like, say, play Juggler and then Call to Arms...) But I'll keep trying it. I get the feeling it's probably better in a Handbuff deck, but I'm burned out on trying that. So, I was at 120 gold for finishing the Priest quest and got my pack... which gave me golden Aluneth (read: 1600 dust.) One Grumble, please! So I put together yet another Shaman elemental deck and took it to the ladder. Suddenly, all the Warlocks were gone and I was facing Rogues.

hsreplay.net/replay/qqyWBZVSkrZvFWThWoTupn

There's not a whole lot to say about this game except to note that, halfway through, I clearly became the aggro, since I was spending my FE and Blazecaller battlecries on face damage. It's important against Kingsbane decks to get them as low as possible such that their life gain just won't be enough to keep pace. Shots from afar from 6/5 and 6/6 creatures that have to be removed by Rogues generally by using one's face are good for that. He was packing Assassinate, though. Is that typical in Kingsbane decks these days? Can't say that I've seen it as often as the plant. Also, I've been playing since the second week of the closed beta and I never knew there was a damage stack in Hearthstone. On turn 9, he goes to zero life to get rid of the Tar Creeper but the Leeching Poison on his weapon saves him. That's how it used to work in MTG, but it no longer does. If you go to zero life, you're dead and you've lost. Not in HS, apparently. I mean, I knew that Deathrattles and other abilities dependent on lethal damage will activate even if a minion is reduced to zero health, but I thought players were different.

Played a couple more Rogues and beat them and then I ran into a Dragon Priest. I mention this game for one reason.

hsreplay.net/replay/n7mHSjyskejpXpLLfNKNSW

On turn 4, we confront the essential problem of Elemental decks: the "played last turn" mechanic. My opponent has 2 Ascendants in play. They're going to continue to buff each other and/or anything else he puts down. I need to remove them. But I'd rather play Jade Spirit because I just drew into Servant, which means I could keep an unbroken chain of Elemental "last turn" effects going for the next three turns. But I can't because I have to make the smart play and Devolve his board. That means my Servant becomes an overcosted Yeti and I have to break tempo and wait to play other things or they, too, are just overcosted vanilla minions. No deck is going to draw or play perfectly, but Elemental decks get bogged down by that so frequently because there's nothing like Brainstorm in the game to manipulate your draws. Being able to know what's coming is kind of important to "played last turn" mechanics, which is precisely why Elemental decks, by and large, aren't competitive. They're not only draw dependent, but are also sequence dependent. It's like trying to pull off a dozen little combos per game. Most combo decks only try to do 1 or 2 because they're difficult to do by design. Midrange minion decks shouldn't be that way.

I had board control by turn 6 and was going to Murmuring/Servant next turn, but he decided he'd had enough and bailed. Also, the reason Murmuring didn't become a universally-played card for Shaman is because of the specificity of the battlecry: Your next Battlecry this turn triggers twice.That means that whatever you're going to try to do is always going to cost two extra mana. Is it worth 2 mana to get another 5 damage out of Blazecaller? Yes. But, again, your deck is sequence dependent, which just makes it more difficult than other minion-based decks.
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Hearthstone Players! 18 Jan 2018 10:13 #261376

I am playing a Recruit Shaman that's ok. Folks are looking for something to do with Shaman, so this was the number 1 deck for Views on HearthPwn yesterday. I tweaked it a little to play White Eyes and Injured Blademaster. I like Blademaster in Shaman quite a bit. The Totem heal and the Healing Rain make it pretty robust, and that it can be recruited out is a huge boon.
www.hearthpwn.com/decks/1022138-new-arch...cruit-control-shaman

The original build uses Spellstone, which I just can't do. God that is a shitty card. I'd rather Totem and Cobalt Scalebane with 7 mana than play Spellstone. The stuff I would WANT to copy, like Earth Ele and White Eyes can't be played on the same turn as Spellstone. So I'l end up copying nothing or some weakened version of it by the time I get a chance. There's no upside. Do I want to spend 7 mana for another Thing From Below?! The only reason I play that is because it's free, paying 7 for a second one seems dumb.
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Hearthstone Players! 18 Jan 2018 10:28 #261383

It's weird how Shaman tends to be either top or bottom of any given meta - it's rarely in the mid-tier.

Faced a new (to me) variant spell Hunter build earlier which went like this:

- Play defensive secrets and an Eaglehorn bow and between them protect yourself from all threats
- Drop the spellstone for 4 wolves
- Drop Highmane and then use Play Dead and Terrorscale Stalker to trigger its deathrattle twice
- Win

I just had nothing against it. Everything I played got killed or returned to my hand and the next thing I know his board is full and I'm dead.
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Hearthstone Players! 18 Jan 2018 11:46 #261402

@jeb: Yeah, that's similar to the Recruiter deck I've been playing, except with EEs and Recalls. I think their intent with Sapphire was that it would encourage people to play shitty Overload cards because of the potential huge payoff. In other words, it's a Timmy card, because 1 game in 7, you'll actually get it to pay off and that'll make it all worth it. But if you actually want to... you know... win, you're better off looking elsewhere. My other complaint about the deck is Far Sight. The card is just awful. It's the base set equivalent of Lightspawn in Priest. No one likes it, but you use it because it facilitates something else (Divine/Inner.) In the case of Far Sight, it's in this deck because there's no room for any kind of card draw, which Shaman sucks at, because you don't want to Recruit an Acolyte of Pain. But 9 times out of 10, Far Sight doesn't give you shit. Cast it on turn 3 and you're as likely to get a card that you still can't cast for 2 or 3 turns as you are a lower cost card that you probably don't want to cast on that early turn, anyway, because the only reason you'd be playing Far Sight is because you're playing control, which means that you want to play your card usage a little more carefully. It's just an awful card. If it cost 2 mana, it might be worth it, but I still think the experience would be almost universally negative, as mine has been.

@Matt: I've seen Kibler run into that version of the Hunter deck. It seems cool, but is still fairly draw dependent. Did you get a look at what he was using for draw, if anything?
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Hearthstone Players! 18 Jan 2018 11:59 #261405

Your comments are spot-on. I dropped the Spellstones and the Far Sight for the Blademasters and White Eyes. I didn't even play the deck once as written on HearthPwn. I don't find myself short on cards, largely, as my threats are huge and have staying power. Compare to Hunter, where you are obliged to rebuild your board turn over turn. My biggest fears are Silence and Polymorph value plays. Here's my build...

### Recruit
# Class: Shaman
# Format: Standard
# Year of the Mammoth
#
# 2x (2) Ancestral Spirit
# 1x (2) Devolve
# 2x (2) Jade Claws
# 2x (2) Maelstrom Portal
# 2x (3) Drakkari Defender
# 2x (3) Feral Spirit
# 1x (3) Healing Rain
# 2x (3) Injured Blademaster
# 2x (3) Lightning Storm
# 2x (4) Flamewreathed Faceless
# 1x (4) Hex
# 2x (4) Jade Lightning
# 2x (5) Earth Elemental
# 2x (5) Guild Recruiter
# 1x (5) White Eyes
# 1x (6) Aya Blackpaw
# 1x (6) Thing from Below
# 2x (7) Corridor Creeper
#
AAECAfe5Agb+BfuqAqa8ApS9Ava9AvPnAgzuAZQD9QTVCPUI96oCoLYCh7wC0bwC/s0C+9MC9ecCAA==

I actually just swapped one Ancestral Spirit (now 1x) for a Devolve (now 2x). I could see swapping in an Evolve or DK instead too, though.
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Last Edit: 18 Jan 2018 12:11 by jeb.
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Hearthstone Players! 18 Jan 2018 22:01 #261454

That's cool. I didn't think about the Blademasters with the Recruiter. That's a pretty good idea for a midgame basher who's just there to clean house for you and makes a solid alternate target for the Ancestrals. After playing a few more games with the Elemental deck and only playing Grumble once, I decided it's just not workable. So I went back to my other recent dust purchase and slotted Val'anyr into my Handbuff deck. This is what it looks like at the moment:

Bloodsail Corsair x 2
Meanstreet Marshal x 2
Patches the Pirate
Righteous Protector x 2
Smuggler's Run x 2
Prince Keleseth
Rallying Blade x 2
Southsea Captain
Sword of Justice x 2
Wickerflame Burnbristle
Corpsetaker x 2
Saronite Chain Gang x 2
Doppelgangster x 2
Grimestreet Enforcer x 2
Grook Fu Master
Sunkeeper Tarim
Val'anyr
Bonemare x 2
Tirion Fordring

The weakest part is the Grook Fu Master, whose only purpose in the deck is to fully upgrade the Corpsetakers. Yes, Timmy, it would be awesome if he was the recipient of Val'anyr, but let's be serious now. My first thought is to remove him for a Spellbreaker and then find a way to include a couple Corridor Creepers, since I'm going to be minion heavy and 6/6s or even 7/7s for free are even better than 5/5s. But, honestly, I'm not sure they're essential to the deck, mostly because I don't think it will ever be a real ladder climber. Handbuff just still isn't that good. Like Elementals, it's still too sequence dependent to make it viable in a meta where every game is about clearing the opposing board on every turn. I know most will probably look at the SoJs as too slow, but they're really glorious. Like in this game:

hsreplay.net/replay/WJ2tRcrFHwnQ2JMpQB7bH9

Drawing the SoJ on turn 3 allowed me to play a 3/4 that took out my opponent's weapon and brought in a 2/2 charger. For 1 mana. Insane in the membrane. Granted, I'm only playing a Shaman (playing a (ahem) Guild Recruiter deck...) but turn 4 lets me drop two 4/5 taunts for 4 mana. Everyone stopped playing SoJ back in the day because GvG was just too fast for it to make a difference and Ooze and Harrison were everywhere. We've been playing a set with legendary weapons for over a month and I've barely seen Ooze or Harrison. Granted, most of the legendary weapons are pretty subpar, but still. And that seeming "god draw" really isn't. That happens routinely, I still want the Spellbreaker because the deck will be useless against Voidlord and I'm not even imagining success against Razakus. But having some silence will be a positive thing in most circumstances.
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Hearthstone Players! 19 Jan 2018 02:22 #261456

Jackwraith wrote:
@Matt: I've seen Kibler run into that version of the Hunter deck. It seems cool, but is still fairly draw dependent. Did you get a look at what he was using for draw, if anything?

Tracking. But to be honest I think he just had a perfect draw of the cards needed to make it work, Felt like one of those decks that's almost impossible to beat when it's on curve but flaky otherwise. Without Freezing Trap, it's very vulnerable to early aggression.
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Oftentimes defeat is splendid, victory may still be shame;
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