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TOPIC: Hearthstone Players!

Hearthstone Players! 27 Feb 2018 13:24 #264093

It's going to be very nice not to have to play around Potion of Madness in Arena, because every Priest has it in their hand, always.
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Hearthstone Players! 27 Feb 2018 13:55 #264094

Ice Block headed to Hall of Fame, Thank goodness. I think Molten heading there and getting the revert is cool too. I was hoping that was a thing that could happen. Gives me hope for Raza, for example. Sucks to see that card go to zero plays, and it's not like it was dominant on the Wild scene even before they made Giants even easier. Coldlight rotating is interesting. I hope they add something that can still generically punish greedy decks. Milling out combo pieces/N'Zoth was always a nice feeling.

What else is rotating:
  • Eater of Secrets--they gotta put something here, right? EoS isn't great, but Secret Mage is a thing.
  • Rallying Blade--I think the transition to Maul is fine, for the most part. Makes weenie decks a little weaker, I think.
  • Mark of Y'Shaarj--Tough on Aggro Druid, coupled with rotation its best target, the Enchanted Raven. I only played Aggro Druid in Wild, so not super stressed.
  • Blood to Ichor--Made the cut in Warrior decks that used Executes conservatively.
  • N'Zoth's First Mate--Fine in a vacuum, hated in context. Anyone else ever lose to NFM, Upgrade, Upgrade on consecutive turns? Good times.
  • Arcane Giant--fuuuuuuuuuuuck I will miss this big creaky bastard.
  • The Curator--I played this way more everyone else. My Maly Rogues packed this as Maly #2 for consistency.
  • Prince Malchezaar--I never had cause to use him, but I know a lot of newer players LOVE this guy. He made the game fun for Timmy.
  • Cat Trick--Sad to see this one go. Cat Trick and Snake Trap were the greedy game go-tos for Hunter Secrets.
  • Medivh's Valet--best tempo 2-drop in the game by far. Healthy for this to go, but I will need to learn a new way to play Mage in Standard.
  • Netherspite Historian--Man... Priest, you are hurting.
  • Kun the Forgotten King--Good. Not everyone had the cards to play these crazy Druid decks, and thank god because this shit was unfair.
  • Drakonid Operative--uh... Rotate to basic set? Like with Evolve? Uhm. Hmm. What is Priest going to power Duskbreaker with? Twilight Drake?
  • Kabal Crystal Runner--see Medivh's Valet above. The other best 2-drop in the game (wink!)
  • Burgly Bully--Aw dang. I have powered many memes with this card. I will miss this.
  • White Eyes---It's ok, I know it was just me.
  • Greater Healing Potion--Going to be some transformative shit going on with Priest.
  • Dirty Rat--Ok, we're all screwed forever.
  • Getaway Kodo--not going to lie, I loved the mind games of Noble Sac and this.
  • I Know A Guy--One of the best enablers for Warrior Quest. Bloodhoof Brave and Alley Armorsmith gone too--oh well.
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Hearthstone Players! 27 Feb 2018 14:42 #264098

They'll have to do better for counterplay against Secrets in the future. No one played Kezan Mystic. No one played Eater of Secrets. Both were hindered by the simple problem that they were bad minions by themselves, so they created a weakness in any deck that ran them that didn't run into a Secret-wielding opponent. If Eater had been, say, a 3-cost 3/4, it probably would have seen play.
I still think Paladin needs a 3-strength weapon of some kind. If they cut Blade and don't replace it, people will just revert to Truesilver, which Team 5 has finally succeeded in removing from most Paladin decks.
I'll miss Arcane Giant, too. I just slotted him into a Dragon Soul deck the other day in a vain attempt to make it work.
It'll be weird to not have Cat Trick around. People jumped through a lot of hoops trying to play around it in the midgame.
Like I said above, I have no idea how they're going to keep Priest viable and make Shaman actually part of the meta without either some near-broken cards that will be in every deck or a wider selection of class cards than they've had in the past. If each class is still limited to 10 with the new set, it's going to be rough either for those classes or for balance overall.
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Hearthstone Players! 01 Mar 2018 08:08 #264211

It really sucks that they're not unnerfing Yogg. Yeah it's the most bullshit card they've ever printed, but isn't that the whole point of Wild. Oh well.

Otherwise, I'm pretty happy with this rotation, although I find Coldlight going to the hall... odd? I see their justification that it was gumming up the works with certain battlecry mechanics and I understand that, but I still think the possibility of Mill as a mechanic is something that should be explored, and losing a neutral card draw is going to slow the game down further. Normally I'm all for that but the balance might go too much in the other direction.

I know I say this every time I talk about Hearthstone but at some point they're going to have to add new cards to classic, or create another five - ten basic cards for each class. This game needs a viable F2P playerbase to stay strong and right now they continue to get weaker and weaker. If I was a F2P and focused on mage, losing the iceblocks that I saved up for then built my deck around would be a major setback (yes, they're giving you the full dust value back, but that doesn't factor in the loss in value to other cards.)

Finally, and this exacerbates the problem of weakening the F2P playerbase, this is the most cards that will be leaving at once, with 315 cards leaving (vs 208 last year and 153 in 2016.) I wonder if the April set will have more than 135 cards in it.
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Hearthstone Players! 01 Mar 2018 09:40 #264228

Stonecutter wrote:
Otherwise, I'm pretty happy with this rotation, although I find Coldlight going to the hall... odd? I see their justification that it was gumming up the works with certain battlecry mechanics and I understand that, but I still think the possibility of Mill as a mechanic is something that should be explored, and losing a neutral card draw is going to slow the game down further. Normally I'm all for that but the balance might go too much in the other direction.

I think their concern with milling as a strategy is the general lack of graveyard mechanics. Once those cards are burned, they're burned. You can't retrieve them, not even with things like Twilight's Call, since the minion would've had to have been in play in order to be resummoned. Combine the lack of reuse with the smaller size of decks in HS as compared to most other card games and it often really hurts to lose even a couple cards, especially when the Oracle could be bounced, as it frequently was. I saw Kingsbane decks that won through Shadowstepping Oracle as much as they did through retrieving their weapon. They're also quite concerned with counterplay and there basically is none against someone burning your deck, especially if you're playing higher cost cards that you simply can't get out of your hand in time to make room for new ones.
Stonecutter wrote:
Finally, and this exacerbates the problem of weakening the F2P playerbase, this is the most cards that will be leaving at once, with 315 cards leaving (vs 208 last year and 153 in 2016.) I wonder if the April set will have more than 135 cards in it.

Yep. This is what jeb and I have been talking about above. The void for Shamans (Jade) and Priests (Dragons) from what's rotating out seems to be so huge that they'll have a tough time filling it with just 10 cards per class, unless those cards are seriously OP and become instant staples. With this many cards leaving the environment, a lot of decks will be instantly unplayable. Big Priest is gone without Barnes and Y'Shaarj. All other Priest decks take a hit without Drakonid OP and Dragonfire Potion. Can you imagine any competitive Shaman deck without Jade Claws and Jade Lightning? The loss of Evolve is ameliorated by Deathseer and Unstable, if you still want to do Evolve decks, but those haven't even been that great. Firebat was playing plain, old token/Bloodlust Shaman the other day.

One of the arguments against three sets per year was the increasing cost of the game, but I have a hard time understanding how they're going to keep all nine classes with something interesting to play (I'm not even approaching the "competitive" angle) with this much of a transition. It might be 4 months of 6 or 7 classes in the game.
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Hearthstone Players! 01 Mar 2018 09:52 #264230

Yogg was so crazy. SO, so crazy. Un-nerfing would actually violate some of the norms they established with "source must be present" effects that used to make things so confusing. (Remember how Wild Pyromancer used to interact with things like Mind Games?) I'm okay wit leaving as is. It's still pretty nuts.

I went into Wild Brawl with a Priest deck, for some reason, despite climbing with Mage on that Ladder. First deck I ran into was a very defensively built Jade Druid, so no chance there. Next was an Aggro Shaman and I just obliterated him. Turn 1 Tunnel Trogg, turn 2 Crackle! I am looking at my Duskbreaker, Lightbomb, Twilight Guardian, &c hand and just feeling bad for that guy. I think I got to 19 at one point.

Jackwraith has long posts above about the quality of Priest and Shaman Basic/Classic cards. Those two heroes always take the most lumps post-rotation. They really need decent expansion pools to be viable.

//edit: I wrote this before seeing Jackwraith's reply, haha
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Hearthstone Players! 01 Mar 2018 10:58 #264245

jeb wrote:
  • Dragonfire Potion—Oof. Priest is staring straight at the dumpster. Duskrider is good, Psychic Scream is ok, but there needs to be something in between other then Auchenai + Circle.

  • If I were to reintroduce cards to classic/basic, the very first card I'd pick would be lightbomb. It's insane to me that Priest doesn't have something like that in the base kit.
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    Hearthstone Players! 01 Mar 2018 12:31 #264270

    Hard to say much about future meta without knowing what they put in next expansion. What we do know is Controlock and Cubelock only lose Mixtress. Priest decks will mostly be combo priest. They will throw a few dragons in new set.

    Went 6 wins with a fucked up Barnes Priest build in tavern brawl. Forgot to add shadow essence. Made it super greedy w kel Thuzad and Emporer Thaurissan. If you ever rez statue and kel Thuzad it’s checkmate. The rewards for 6 wins were not that much. 75 gold. 50 dust and cardback. I don’t know if I will spend 150 gold to try again. Saw Control the board get 12 with Aviana Maly combo otk Druid. Don’t have her or Kun. Tempo freeze Mage looks good to me though
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    Hearthstone Players! 01 Mar 2018 13:29 #264279

    It'll be interesting to see if, in the new expansion, they try to boost Shaman's power level and/or maintain Priest's because right now they're locked into a boom/bust power level cycle with those classes.

    Coldlight being HOF'ed was surprising but I understand the rationale. Rogue occupies a conflicted place in my mind where I really like how the class plays, I like milling, I like Kingsbane, I really respect players that can pilot Rogue decks well, but I hate playing against them.

    It would be nice to see a new Warrior archetype emerge that isn't just yet another flavor of pirates or control/fatigue, and it would also be nice if they laid off the stupid murlocs and buffs for Paladin. Though, to be fair, four of the seven Paladin class legendaries in Standard are playable so they're at least getting that right.

    In Dungeon Run news, after 68 boss defeats I finally beat it with Priest. I was on a break since I was determined to win with Priest before trying another class (yes, I am a bit of a masochist, why do you ask?), and in true Heroic Naxx/BRM Dungeon Run fashion, my winning run was very nearly a cakewalk. I had the spell cost reduction passive, as well as the treasure that is a 0/3 for 0 weapon that gives a random Mage spell at the beginning of your turn. My deck was a mishmash of stuff since I drafted Reno and my only dupes were 2x Cleric and 2x Lyra (spoiler alert: I didn't use Reno once in the entire run).

    I drew Azari for my final boss and I crushed him. I drew the weapon on turn two and played Lyra on curve so my hand was at 9-10 cards the whole game. I even got an Echo of Medivh to copy my Lyra and Cultist but it turns out I didn't even need the second Lyra. I kept ahead on tempo (Velen's Chosen on my cleric on Turn 2 is preettty good) and while I didn't need to Pyroblast him for the win, it sure was satisfying.

    I've moved on to Warrior (see earlier masochism comment) and it's pretty rough. So far I've lost to the 4th, 5th and 7th bosses and I haven't been able to make dragons nor taunts (even with the "all 5+ cost minions cost 5" passive) work. I might try weapons or damage next.
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    Hearthstone Players! 01 Mar 2018 15:17 #264294

    Just in case no one has logged in, Ranked play is currently suspended. There was a bug on the Asia servers that was giving people five stars for wins, instead of one, so they've suspended it everywhere until they figure it out. So, if you have a cool deck idea that you'd never take into Ranked for fear of losing too many stars, Casual is effectively Ranked at the moment, so fire away.

    I went in trying to finish some quests and ran into a cool Gibberer Rogue deck. His whole strategy was to try to keep the board clear so he could keep hitting me with Gibberers so that he had a steady stream of Combo openers. Meanwhile he waited for his spiders to show up. It was pretty cool, but board clears from Big Priest finally did away with it (I had the damn Play 20 Minions that cost 5 or more quest again and I'm just as likely to play them with Big Priest as I am my other decks and meanwhile I can actually complete the 3 Wins with Any quest, too.)
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    Hearthstone Players! 01 Mar 2018 17:37 #264304

    @Sebastian, Warrior's starter deck is pretty good for the early game. You need to get big stuff or some of the early bosses can outlast you. If that Dragon lady gets her synergies going, you can just lose to fatigue as you plink away at her huge Taunts. The problem with taking the Weapons package is that it increases the odds of seeing it again and again, and you basically never want that. It's tough. As noted above, Captured Flag and Scepter of Summoning are the plan.

    Washed out of the Brawl with that Priest deck. Beat a Secret Mage, but lost to Cubelock that currrrrrrrved and hit me for 40 in Doomguards in two turns and then another Jade Druid. Like, fuck me, man. Oh well. 40g for my troubles.
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    Hearthstone Players! 01 Mar 2018 21:36 #264317

    I went with Tunnel Trogg/Overload Aggro Shaman in the Wild Brawl and bombed out at 7, but I got enough gold for an Arena run so I consider that a win.
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    Hearthstone Players! 02 Mar 2018 09:09 #264367

    Ranked play is up again and they're giving everyone three Kobolds packs next week as compensation of the delay. Woo?

    I hadn't finished my 20 minions over 5 quest (I was two away when I had to stop yesterday) so I pulled out Warlock control, figuring that I'd play Lackeys for sure and possibly Voidlords. I did end up playing both Lackeys, but both Voidlords were played by the Skull. I was playing against the new Control Warrior, which is armor, armor, and more armor, while Gather Your Party brings in Ysera, Yip, Grom, and whatever else. It's basically Big Priest: about 5-7 large minions, tons of spells, Dead Man's Hand to extend the game, etc. This one had Yogg, though, and that's how he won. I had one card left when he played Yogg, who promptly cleared Rin and a Voidwalker, Shadow Essenced Grom, damaged him, somehow gave him another +4 attack, summoned an Enchanted Raven, Naturalized it so I was on one fatigue, and gave Grom Windfury. Grom hit me for 28 and then I died to fatigue. I detest Yogg, but that was funny.
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    Hearthstone Players! 02 Mar 2018 12:44 #264390

    Yep, back to slinging with Hunter. Took down a couple Paladins in short order and had lethal in hand against a Secret Hunter when my HS client crashed (Mac). Fucking unreal. It couldn't survive the shake animation of a Corridor Creeper hitting the board (to power the Kill Command FTW). So pissed. Like, every game is precious, man. I can't lose games like this. Fucking Unity engine PoS.
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    Hearthstone Players! 02 Mar 2018 13:30 #264394

    jeb wrote:
    @Sebastian, Warrior's starter deck is pretty good for the early game. You need to get big stuff or some of the early bosses can outlast you. If that Dragon lady gets her synergies going, you can just lose to fatigue as you plink away at her huge Taunts. The problem with taking the Weapons package is that it increases the odds of seeing it again and again, and you basically never want that. It's tough. As noted above, Captured Flag and Scepter of Summoning are the plan.

    Warrior is hard because the only removal you start with in your deck is Brawl, so if you lose tempo against most bosses you're screwed. Last night I pulled the "all weapons cost 1" passive and picked weapons next since there was a Gorehowl and a 1 mana Gorehowl is pretty good. It worked out pretty well until I ran up against the boss whose hero power gives his minions +1/+1. I could only make so many trades and kill so many minions before I lost the board and got overwhelmed. I'm seriously considering a hard restart if I ever get three crappy passives to choose from because I'm just getting stomped.

    And then I tried Warlock and OMG it sucked. I ran out of cards and nearly lost to the first boss(!) and I drew Corruption on Turn 1/2 in all. Three. Fucking. Games. What, three games you say? Yes, I lost to the third goddamned boss because in every one of my games my hand was comprised of useless 1-3 mana cost spells (including the aforementioned Corruption) and all of my 4-5 cost minions. I know DR is an RNG fest but that run really tilted me. No worries, I'm sure I'll be back at it tonight, sticking my hand on the hot stove and complaining about the heat...

    What Hunter deck are you playing? I'm having a lot of fun with the Barnes Spell Hunter but I noticed that there's a midrange build that's doing pretty well.
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