Joan of Errata & the Siege of Setup - A Time of Legends Review

Exactly. The best, most timeless games that you come back to year after year are never going to be these big honking tugboats full of components, 500 scenarios, 500 variant characters, etc. Games like this are, with very very few exceptions all but written off after a year.

But bust out Citadels, Colossal Arena, Tikal, For Sale, Nexus Ops...never a chore.

It is disappointing that some Kickstarter marketer out there decided it was far more profitable to ask people to buy an entire life cycle for a game at one time, as opposed to putting out targeted expansions over time. The expansions would be of higher quality, and they would get played far more.

Witness the old FFG expansion model, before they just started churning out serial product lines. It would be like a year or more for a well-developed expansion that had time to mature and react to the game’s reception and how it was being played. Versus buying 3 expansions up front and if you don’t get them in the campaign you are SOL.

That mode made games like Ti3, GOT, Descent, Runebound, Arkham Horror last and stay relevant for YEARS. In contrast to shitting out an entire product line in one go and the doing it again for “season 2”.

Setup time and a built-in expansion model plagued Heroscape, one of my favorite games of all time, which I hardly ever play now. Still haven't gotten rid of all of it. I can't bring myself to do it.

It had a similar "game can potentially be shorter than setup" factor, which is why you'd leave it out and play multiple games, if possible.

Balance was definitely 'off' too, but there was so much content released that there was plenty of variety at even a tournament level, in my opinion.

I think of GW’s perpetual cycle of releasing new editions or sourcebooks to fix problems that create new ones. A wonderful means of constantly selling products.

Some of these massive kickstarters have been hits for me. Cthulhu Wars (although it’s now so bloated it is overwhelming), Hellboy and Mythic Battles are all favorites.

And being someone that spent decades as a miniatures gamer, these games have a certain appeal to me as basically miniatures games in a self-contained box(es).

But I only have so much room and time so my interest in acquiring more is next to none and I am more interested now in fun, one box games that are interesting, can be played a bit, then put away and revisited easily later.

I already have enough deep and expansive games to last so many years to come.

Sagrilarus wrote:

Andi Lennon wrote: Kingdom Death Colon Monster

In 2002 games were labeled "elegant" and "refined" precisely because they were minimalist, and it was deemed the ultimate game publishing goal. Now it's about revenue and bigger is better, even bigger is even better. Another situation where "crowd sourcing" has proven that the crowd might just, on occasion, be stupid.

In spite of your light-handed approach your article is a pretty solid condemnation of this particular delivery.

Hahaha I don't even have *a* table. There's simply nowhere in my house where even a modest one will fit. If you look at the shots I've taken myself you'll notice that we're always playing on the floor, sacrificing our lower backs to the greater good as our feet fall asleep beneath hunched knees.

https://mongolcult.files.wordpress.com/2020/04/wolves-printed.jpg?w=1000&h=

As I grow more canny with my balancing of 'aspiration vs. reality' I'm sure my habit of acquisition will evolve accordingly. It's depressing to realise that no matter how the cool the concept of a game is, without the opportunity to actually play it, it's just a bunch of stuff clogging up not only your living space but more importantly, your psyche as well. And as a sometime pantheist (especially when I'm playing pinball) I believe these objects are invested with a life of their own but only via osmosis, which means they need to be played.

As for the inclinations of the mob, I'm put in mind of the Lisa Simpsons quote: "He'll never go broke appealing to the lowest common denominator" and sadly, in a sick society that is predicated almost solely on the accumulation of things, most people have very little creative flex when it comes to expression of their agency or attempts at manifesting happiness. So they buy stuff. The more stuff the better. I'm not immune but i catch myself sometimes and i'm aghast.

The fact that we're yet to see a backlash against all this stuff doesn't mean there won't be one. It's quite likely that refined and self-contained experiences will swing sine-wave like back into the ascendant as more people realise the sheer impracticality of scale and that the return on investment , not even money-wise, but measured in 'initial joy of novelty vs. eventual overwhelmed anxiety' is tilted poorly.

n815e wrote: I think of GW’s perpetual cycle of releasing new editions or sourcebooks to fix problems that create new ones. A wonderful means of constantly selling products..

Oh man, as someone who until recently could only lay claim to some nascent dabbling with Rogue Trader way back in the day, I'd managed to pretty successfully avoid the whole spiked rabbit-hole of GW mania.

Then everyone here and throughout the game-o-sphere went bananas over Warcry and I took the plunge on the starter set. I've assembled it and got as far as painting the two warbands and maybe two of the beasts and a ladder or two (everyone's favourite part of the hobby-painting ladders).

I've played it once.

We did two different scenarios and whilst it was pretty fun, the fiddliness of rulers has never sat right with me when as a species we have a perfectly good grasp on hexagons. I can see it coming out again, maybe even this weekend but the weird thing is I realised I was already contemplating grabbing another warband. Or maybe some of the cards that meant I could use other minis.

Games Workshop's stock prices are clearly not skyrocketing through random chance. Their whole marketing schtick is an almost weaponised sense of completionism fomo and continual upgrade cycles. Even the act of calling something a 'Starter Set' is a not-so-subtle psychological lure.

So yeah, I'm wary. I'm not a dyed in the wool "hobbyist" so forests of sprues have a limited appeal and I've backed away. I assemble and paint infrequently and whilst I initially found it relaxing, it became less so as I grew more aware of what I perceived to be a 'backlog'. These were no longer just cool toys, they were becoming an unfinished task. A chore. A hang-up. It wasn't a cool feeling. And whilst their minis are really well done, the whole He-Man on steroids covered in spikes thing is a bit fucking gauche in the end.

Getting back to JoA though- Staggering, ludicrously, farcically, Mythic games released another version of the Reliquary booklet this week and not only did it feature the wrong maps and feature tiles that did not exist in the game, BUT IT WAS MISSING ENTIRE PAGES. It beggars belief. It's almost like an elaborate prank at this stage.

I want to note one thing: It is impossible to transport these games in the metro or in a bus. They are very unconfortable to walk with. They require to be played in your own house or to drive.

Erik Twice wrote: I want to note one thing: It is impossible to transport these games in the metro or in a bus. They are very unconfortable to walk with. They require to be played in your own house or to drive.

You forgot via private helicopter or luxury yacht.

Edit-played Warcry again tonight and yeah, it's a lot of fun (despite the petty squabbling over inches). The choice of scenarios can make a big difference. I can see it becoming a more regular outing and anticipate horrendous grudges evolving as the trash talk reaches far beyond fun and on into the pure heart of darkness...

Andi Lennon wrote: Edit-played Warcry again tonight and yeah, it's a lot of fun (despite the petty squabbling over inches). The choice of scenarios can make a big difference. I can see it becoming a more regular outing and anticipate horrendous grudges evolving as the trash talk reaches far beyond fun and on into the pure heart of darkness...

I’ve learned to just be flexible with measurements in miniatures games. A few millimeters shouldn’t be cause for controversy.
You give up a lot of precision in exchange for the 3d environment.

Oh absolutely, I'm firmly in that camp, however my opponent(s) can often veer into persnickety territory, especially when an objective is on the line. Plus I guess it's natural to want to fudge a lineball reading when it comes at the culmination of a multi-round strategic build up and looming coup de grace. Just as it's natural to in turn verbally malign their mother's virtue