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Let's Talk About Root

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31 Aug 2020 12:33 #313630 by Jexik
Replied by Jexik on topic Let's Talk About... Root
So I went and picked up the Steam version of Root which is still in early access.

It's kinda neat to have the option of pretty quick, AI-filled solo games. I haven't tried the online multiplayer yet. So far even on Hard the AI doesn't seem to play the Eyrie super well, going into turmoil fairly often and not putting enough pressure on the Cats, who seem to run away with the win if you're the Vagabond or WA. There are some Challenges that are kinda fun until it asks you to get a dominance win as the WA...
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23 Nov 2020 16:33 - 23 Nov 2020 16:44 #316477 by Gary Sax
Replied by Gary Sax on topic Let's Talk About... Root
www.twitch.tv/videos/806428644

Patrick Leder and Cole Wehrle say that there is another Root expansion coming, which makes sense given how popular the game is (rat raiders and maybe defensive turtles). Specifically, though, they're focusing on designing several high reach factions with big board presence. I think this is very smart, the game really needs lots of reach factions or else someone gets forced into being the cats or the birds which is... fine but it doesn't feel great. Cole dreaming of having NPC minor factions in the game that fill out reach and have some form of interaction with the live players.
Last edit: 23 Nov 2020 16:44 by Gary Sax.

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15 Dec 2020 13:34 - 15 Dec 2020 13:35 #317212 by Gary Sax
Replied by Gary Sax on topic Let's Talk About... Root
www.twitch.tv/videos/830283228

More about minor factions which, if you use them, operate as a sort of balance function. If you're losing or get unlucky, you can buy minor faction control for a certain period of time. Sounds good to me but I'm glad it's only coming in during expansion number 3... sounds sort of crufty late expansion stuff. I tend to like this kind of weird shit---the last Roll for the Galaxy expansion has this characteristic and the Orb, the one I've played with, is great.

They also talk about variable setup rules with a couple balance tweaks, which sounds like a really good idea.
Last edit: 15 Dec 2020 13:35 by Gary Sax.

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17 Dec 2020 11:16 #317280 by JoelCFC25
Replied by JoelCFC25 on topic Let's Talk About... Root
Turtles have morphed into badgers now, predictably some people have their feelings hurt though I don't get why. I trust them to know what they're doing, but I'm curious about the complexity of testing/balancing when so many factions exist already (fully acknowledging I have no design chops at all).

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17 Dec 2020 11:21 #317284 by Gary Sax
Replied by Gary Sax on topic Let's Talk About... Root
They said they were going to lean on woodland warriors discord in late playtesting. Makes sense, it's an immense playtesting task and that place is filled with rabid fans playing thousands of games.

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17 Dec 2020 11:53 #317286 by hotseatgames
I can't imagine future factions interesting me. I want to like Root a lot more than I actually like Root. The faction stew is so wildly out of whack, I find it frustrating.

I'll take Lords of Hellas any day.
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17 Dec 2020 11:58 #317287 by Shellhead
Replied by Shellhead on topic Let's Talk About... Root
With a multi-player conflict game with asymmetric factions, it is always tempting for the designer to leave game balance to the players.

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17 Dec 2020 13:05 #317291 by Gary Sax
Replied by Gary Sax on topic Let's Talk About... Root
I like but don't love Root (I think I have it an 8 on BGG?). I love Oath and it does a lot of the things I like about Root, only it's much more player creative.
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17 Dec 2020 21:04 #317309 by Not Sure
Replied by Not Sure on topic Let's Talk About... Root
I like Root still, but it doesn't even make the top 3 in my "Games designed by Cole Wehrle" list.

But really, I'll probably still buy another expansion.
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17 Dec 2020 21:36 #317310 by Gary Sax
Replied by Gary Sax on topic Let's Talk About... Root
To be clear, I will too. And I really like the direction they're going---2 big footprint factions and the minor factions ideas (maybe).

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18 Dec 2020 06:42 #317315 by mezike
Replied by mezike on topic Let's Talk About... Root
The comments here pretty much sum up my own feelings, but most particular this one from Not Sure:

Not Sure wrote: I like Root still, but it doesn't even make the top 3 in my "Games designed by Cole Wehrle" list.


I always saw Root as the proxy for the COIN games that I could never get anyone to play but Root has also now become the game that nobody who I know wants to play full stop. If I'm in the mood for Cole's particular brand of "figure out everybody's potential to reach for victory and therefore who you need to manoeuvre against right now because your ship can take more than a few rounds to turn" then I am going to try to drum up interest in John Company or Oath or Pax Pamir. As a result Root has become a game that I play exclusively with my kids, which is just fine because we are familiar with all the factions and each other's play-styles so the game shines every time we play. Even so, I really don't need more content for it and even want to actively strip out and sell the expansions saving the replacement card deck and the Vagabond pack. I even picked up the clockwork pack so that we could have more flex with lower player counts but screw that, Cole's games are designed to be played against people and not against automata.

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08 Jan 2021 13:53 #317836 by Gary Sax
Replied by Gary Sax on topic Let's Talk About... Root
www.twitch.tv/videos/864895788

The Warlord stuff seems neat, but the setup rules are *very* interesting.

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08 Jan 2021 17:52 #317860 by Jexik
Replied by Jexik on topic Let's Talk About... Root
I really like Root and Cole's thoughts on things, but I'm not sure if I'm up for an hour long discussion right now.

I picked up the second expansion at the FLGS a couple months ago and was a little upset to realize that it didn't come with the new deck or the upgrade kit for the earlier factions... those are separate entities.

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08 Jan 2021 17:54 #317861 by Gary Sax
Replied by Gary Sax on topic Let's Talk About... Root
Yeah, those were a big bundle in the kickstarter you had to pay more for too. That deck is like the single biggest value add expansion you could get, though.
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08 Jan 2021 18:00 #317863 by Jexik
Replied by Jexik on topic Let's Talk About... Root
Yeah, the local store had some trouble carrying the base game of Root for awhile, so they weren't carrying the expansions, I had them order the big box thinking it'd have some of that other stuff in it too...

Not that I've really played it since getting it. Most of my in-person gaming is 2p these days.

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