Twilight Struggle on Vassal anyone:?

ozjesting wrote:

The conversation of strategy and such here is WAY advanced on my original propisition ... But that is all I know.

Sounds like you're just a bit more experienced than me so we must be a good match, I'll keep an eye on this thread while I'm getting myself in order.

Black Barney wrote:

We're must be playing some pretty low-level TS cuz our Defcon is ALWAYS at 4 or 5. Last game, which was our closest one ever. Defcon was more at 2 and 3. Maybe we're getting more competitive.

The Soviet player should try to keep DEFCON at 2 always.

and the thinking there, Schweig, is cuz it's harder for the player who's behind to come back when DEFCON is low, right? And since the USSR usually has early momentum, they need to keep it low? Is that the general idea?

Yes, the idea is to prevent the USA from couping.

Most games with experienced players I've played start with three coups in Iran.

This game is now starting to sound quite boring to me with all these 'standard' scripted strategies and card plays that experienced players always use. I wouldn't be surprised if there is a (reasonably involved) flow diagram players use to work out what they should be doing in the game dependent on what has been already played and the current game state.
Becoming disappointed.

It's still a great game for equally experienced players. Although certain strategies exist, and for some cards there's only one way to play them, the game still allows plenty of room for decision making.

Southernman wrote:

This game is now starting to sound quite boring to me with all these 'standard' scripted strategies and card plays that experienced players always use. I wouldn't be surprised if there is a (reasonably involved) flow diagram players use to work out what they should be doing in the game dependent on what has been already played and the current game state.
Becoming disappointed.

I think most good players agree what the first move(s) should be but beyond that it's entirely card dependant and VERY dependant on your opponent's actions.

My wife and I have never had a similar game. Neither of us play the optimal moves mostly because neither of us know them. I myself seem to have a hard on for afghanistan and taiwan so I often start with a focus around there but if my wife is showing signs of interest in the middle east or europe, I may have to act there.

It's a SUPER dynamic game and I guarantee you won't find it boring. I suggest not reading strategy guides or anything since it's more fun just to do what you want and learn.

For instance, I love US players that learn about BLOCKADE cuz they've had it played on them rather than reading that keeping a 3+ card in your hand to the end is a good idea.

Schweig! wrote:

It's still a great game for equally experienced players. Although certain strategies exist, and for some cards there's only one way to play them, the game still allows plenty of room for decision making.

Barney said:

My wife and I have never had a similar game. Neither of us play the optimal moves mostly because neither of us know them. I myself seem to have a hard on for afghanistan and taiwan so I often start with a focus around there but if my wife is showing signs of interest in the middle east or europe, I may have to act there.

But it does sound like if you played some of the more experienced guys here then you would be handed you ass back nearly as fast as they would do me over.
That limitation on finding opponents that will mean the game will be more than one-way traffic means I don't think it will get played that much. I probably have few, if anyone, to play against face to face and it sounds like opponents here for a PBEM play that will last for more than a few turns are small in number.
Not to worry, plenty of games in my collection to play until I get a match.

yeah, I would lose REALLY badly playing against your average player cuz I haven't been challenged properly. Whereas I honestly think my wife would stand a better shot against a random than I would.

But the game is SO good if you find someone around your skill level and if it's a little off, then make the better player play as the US.

Also, the game is SO MUCH FUN to play that it doesn't even matter if you're losing. Like War of the Ring in tha respect. it's RICH in theme.

Tom -- play is definitely not scripted. The phases of learning TS are something like this:

1. This is overwhelming. Too many cards to learn.
2. Oh, now I see the strategy. Always do this when X happens.
3. Wait, wow there are all these other strategies that my opponent isn't anticipating (and believe me, there are more than enough to keep the game different everytime).

Couping Iran first turn is definitely popular, but by no means the only or even the smartest thing to do. It is all really dependent on the cards that are drawn, and then one can bluff what their hand is by making certain plays. The game is more exciting for two experienced players, but learning the game is very exciting as well.

Barney, think of it a little like building a combo deck in MtG -- every hand of TS should be played a little bit like a big combo in Magic mixed in with the knowledge of the card in the deck at Early, Mid, and Late War. That antcipation, gambling, and "going big" factor is awesome for this game.

As for keeping DEFCON at 2, I think that is often times in the interest of either the US or the USSR. It is not the sole province of the USSR player -- especially if you are an experienced US player. One advantage of keeping it at 2, is that the USSR will never be able to coup in ASIA...which should be US dominated. The advantage of couping first as the USSR is because it is like a 2 VP give me every turn. But, there are several cards the US can use to mitigate this as the game goes on.

If this thread is actually still about playing on Vassal, I'd be up for it. Let me know.

MattDP wrote:

If this thread is actually still about playing on Vassal, I'd be up for it. Let me know.

Sounds like I need to get a f2f game or two in first to remember what the game is about, and then a few games with other noobs like Oz (maybe Barney) before I'll be able to give you a competitive or interesting game.


PS Matt, you turn in Arkham

I'm most certainly a n00b at TS. I play for "fun" and often make sub-optimal moves just cuz I actually dislike Bear Trapping my opponent, etc.

Space Ghost, thanks for the explanation! It makes more sense now a bit. Cool way to think of the game, nice perspective.

i love that game SO much

MattDP wrote:

If this thread is actually still about playing on Vassal, I'd be up for it. Let me know.

I am

trashmail sent

Ok you all...I have a game going with Matt and the VASSAL mod is pretty darn sweet! Does most of the work for you!

So now I want to get another one going as school has started and I have afternoons free! So who wants a game of Twilight Struggle?