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Well shucks Geoff, thanks for the discussion! I'll have to take a listen.

What are you talking about? You crowed about your last episode with Golem Arcana here!

Oh wait, that was me.

S.

I normally don't post podcast info here, but in the latest Ludology (Ep 90) we go in depth on Knizia's games, and spend a bit of time discussing Mr. Barnes' take on Knizia and theme in his article from last month.

iTunes or ludology.net if you're interested.

The 'Risk' mechanic in Beowulf completely tanks the game for me, big time.

Some people really like it, but it makes the entire game an enormous crap shoot.

Edit:

As much as I enjoy Chris Farrell's game analysis (it's often amazing), when it comes to Knizia he is clinically insane. He's the fanboy to end all fanboys, and I'm not sure why. Knizia can do no wrong in his book, and even his weakest designs get an 8-9 rating from Farrell.

There might be a few exceptions, but not many.

Dunno the LotR one, but Beowulf's problem is that the board
is a fixed pattern. That works fine for telling a story, but
it cuts into the potential replay of the thing. Given the focus
on game mechanism anyhow, I can't see the story in this one being
important enough to drive a design decision that reduces replay variability
in this way. It really feels very abstract even with the fixed board.

San Il Defanso wrote:
Ra - I figured out that the reason I don't like 7 Wonders is because it's like someone looked at Ra and thought the set-collecting was the most interesting part. Ra has my favorite auction of any game ever, and it's Knizia's best game.

Tigris & Euphrates - It came out 15 years ago, and there still hasn't been a game that's ever come close to approximating the feel of this one. It's a multi-player conflict game filtered through Euro design, and it's just terrific.

Far and away his best. The whole majority group control thing that he specializes
in shine best in these two.

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I liked Knizia's Beowulf game. The reason I traded it off is because the hand management part of it felt a lot like the hand management in his LoTR coop and I like the LoTR game better.

I really want to pick up that Blue Moon Legends, but feel like it'll be lost in the crowd of all my two-player games (the bulk of my collection). It is getting high praise though.

Maybe I'll pass something along for it.

Getting back into Knizia games (and other classic German designs) has been the most refreshed I've felt about board games in a long time.

Would you say these designs are TIMELESS?

Merchants of Amsterdam is probably worth grabbing, you won't see that in print ever again. I played it a couple of times many years ago and don't remember much about the actual gameplay, but of course the main feature is the Dutch auction clock. It's really fun. Basically, you wind it up and it starts going DOWN in price. Somebody has to slap the thing to stop it, so it's basically a game of chicken to see who will stop it and who will try to wait to see how low the price will go. I don't think this one usually goes for much since it's kind of one of those second or third shelf Knizia titles, so it may be cheaper to get on BGG marketplace or eBay than retail.

It is definitely time to re-evaluate Beowulf. The thinking at the time (right in the middle of the whole AT upheaval) was that the game wasn't thematic because the players didn't get to BE Beowulf and it wasn't, I guess, a Talisman-style adventure game. Also at that time where you had to "impress" someone were not in favor. But it's actually MORE effective thematically by casting the players as Beowulf's retinue and charging them, basically, with keeping up with an epic hero. But you can't go all-in on every episode in the adventure, so you have to choose when to kind of hang back, recoup yur strength and let someone else step up. There is A LOT of theme here, and definitely not of the flavor text variety.

Thing is, I've never really been quite sure why an auction or Poker-style card play mechanic is regarded as "too abstract" but rolling a die isn't. There is nothing more abstract than rolling a die to determine an outcome.

My Knizia plays this week were Modern Art (I have tragically underrated this game my entire life) and Blue Moon Legends. The Blue Moon set is REALLY good. I do miss the jumbo cards, but the whole game is here, every card. Lots to explore and the game is so, so good.

As for procurement, I'm really after Amun-Re, Royal Turf/Winner's Circle, and oddly Clash of the Gladiators.

Getting back into Knizia games (and other classic German designs) has been the most refreshed I've felt about board games in a long time.

Bull- Through the Desert for Forged in Fire...think about it...

It definitely seems to approach it in one of those sideways Knizia fashions that ends up being surprisingly effective. I read somewhere (maybe from Christ Farrell) that when Knizia really themes something he tends to push the players toward making the same kind of decisions those in that setting would make. The trappings and flavor remain pretty abstracted, but the decision-making process is where that theme is reflected.

Sometimes it's clearly not important, like in Ra or Taj Mahal. But that view does give games like Lost Cities, Beowulf, and Medici some surprising thematic depth.

This is going to sound really weird, but for me Beowulf: The Legend really immerses me in its setting and theme. I'm not a dark beer fan at all, but come winter time, I _love_ to play Beowulf: The Legend with a pint of dark beer. I feel like I'm a Geat marching along with the company, drinking mead/beer and looking for my share of the loot.

I dunno. I really dig this game.

Barnes sent me an extra copy of Beowulf: The Legend. I glanced over the rules, and now I'm really excited to try it.

WHile we're on Knizia games, has anyone played Merchants of Amsterdam? I saw a copy at the FLGS and it just has the LOOK of an older classic. Not sure I want to invest the time just yet.