Dungeon Degenerates Second Printing Kickstarter Announced

hotseatgames wrote: I may jump in this time. At this point I have more games than time / players. I need a kickstarter that comes with a game group.

blatz wrote: I don’t know, I was really tempted by this until I saw all the Nazi fetish stuff in the art and on the website. I’m all for controversial art that makes people think but all the comments I’ve read from the artist kind of turned me off. For me, if there’s going to be swastikas and shit I’d like it be there for a less juvenile reason than “to piss of the squares

hotseatgames wrote: $200 is an exaggeration, right?

ChristopherMD wrote:

blatz wrote: I don’t know, I was really tempted by this until I saw all the Nazi fetish stuff in the art and on the website. I’m all for controversial art that makes people think but all the comments I’ve read from the artist kind of turned me off. For me, if there’s going to be swastikas and shit I’d like it be there for a less juvenile reason than “to piss of the squares

I have scoured the game for any swastikas already and have never found a single one in its artwork. Please show an image of where one appears in the game.

blatz wrote: I don’t know, I was really tempted by this until I saw all the Nazi fetish stuff in the art and on the website. I’m all for controversial art that makes people think but all the comments I’ve read from the artist kind of turned me off. For me, if there’s going to be swastikas and shit I’d like it be there for a less juvenile reason than “to piss of the squares!”

The game does sound awesome but I guess everyone has their own line for what they’re comfortable with. Maybe I’m just trying to rationalize my way out of spending $200.

I think I was 8 or 9 when I first saw Ralph Bakshi's "Wizards" - in this Dark Fantasy movie the bad guys discover WWII Nazi propaganda & use it during the final battle to disorient the good guys & defeat them in battle. In Wizards it is a form of Black Magic. I had also discovered Bakshi's Lord of the Rings at about the same time & watched & loved Fritz the Cat when I was older. By the time the 80s were rolling along - sexuality, symbolism & fetishism had changed but a lot of the stuff I saw that was leftover from the 70s included this weird mix of BDSM, Leather, Nazi Fetishism, Drugs, Satanism & the like. In the 80s this was still a part of Bay Area street culture & as a young Punk Rocker this bled into the places I would go to find "cool stuff". As part of the aesthetic I've been working on for over a decade I include this hodge podge of 70s tropes that had largely been erased from the public consciousness by the cleansing that happened in the 80s. Most of this stuff came to me via the San Francisco gay scene - I think my first exposure to Nazi Fetishism was through Tom of Finland - it was just background noise & I didn't get it. Then in Punk - original Punk uses Nazi imagery in the same way as one uses anything taboo - it's playing with fire. I understand why people are offended by it & why swastikas are upsetting - & they aren't a central point to the game or the art or anything, they're background noise. That's why they're not "front & center". Just as low-key pervy sexuality & drug use are part of the game - but it's not the point, it's not about hitting you over the head with it, it's to increase the feeling of degeneration & decay - the feeling I had about the 70s when I was a kid. So - this isn't about trying to legitimize or reclaim or promote any of these things, they are elements of the aesthetic that are necessary to communicate the over-all feeling that I am trying to convey. That said - most of the art that is being commented on is work that was done as preliminary work for the game theme before we had any concrete plan on what "Dungeon Degenerates" would turn into. I can give you a list of cultural reference points if you're interested in further research on the subject.