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Sidereal Confluence Being Remastered!

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Sidereal Conflunece Being Remastered!

Game Information

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Release Schedule Information

Release Date
There Will Be Games

Remaster trading and negotiation in the Elysian quadrant.

The acclaimed negotiation game has been remastered!

-Astounding new cover art by Kwanchai Moriya
-Updated card layout
-Cardboard turn and bidding trackers
-Included teaching guide
-Improved rulebook flow for easy setup and learning – includes more visual examples and clear key terms
-Updated insert
-Tauceti Diechmann’s thorough design sits at a unique intersection of simple turn order and complex chains of trading. This refined edition re-implements the gameplay that makes Sidereal Confluence a standout:


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hotseatgames's Avatar
hotseatgames replied the topic: #302083 30 Sep 2019 10:06
I'd love to check this game out. But my shelf is full of games I can't get to the table, and this seems like another one of those.
Gary Sax's Avatar
Gary Sax replied the topic: #302084 30 Sep 2019 10:50
Yeah, I get you. I'm not shelf toad king for nothing.

That said, I could see getting this out with people before a lot of other innovative games because it's real time and it's not as punishing. So, like, archipelago and study in emerald I have no idea if I will ever play because not only are they complex, they are also based in cutthroat deception. Sidereal you can make "bad" trades I guess but not that bad---the game gives the base value if resources, there's open info, and all deals are binding. No one is specifically out to fuck you over.
Frohike's Avatar
Frohike replied the topic: #302097 30 Sep 2019 14:13
4 player minimum = this will never get played here. But I’d totally join a game somewhere.

Confluence typo in the title btw ;)
Josh Look's Avatar
Josh Look replied the topic: #302098 30 Sep 2019 16:48
I really enjoyed it, but the folks I played it with were pretty split on it. Nobody disliked it, they just loved it or didn’t know what to make of it. Perhaps it being easier to teach will help.

The game is really just converting one colored cube into another, the twist is that all that conversion happens via trade, negotiation and variable player powers.
Erik Twice's Avatar
Erik Twice replied the topic: #302099 30 Sep 2019 18:06
For me the issue I face is that every game of Sidereal Confluence I would get to the table I would have one less game of Dune or 18XX or Civilization. Competition is very stiff for me.
Ah_Pook's Avatar
Ah_Pook replied the topic: #302101 30 Sep 2019 18:23
The couple times I played this were okay, but no one loved it and I sold it. It's information overload the game. The actual decisions are very straightforward, the game is who can parse the giant clusterfuck spreadsheet of bullshit well enough to actually see the decisions to make. I'm sure there's another level of game beyond that, but the game is long and intense and wants very large player counts so the odds of ever getting to that next level are nil.
Gary Sax's Avatar
Gary Sax replied the topic: #302102 30 Sep 2019 18:36
My understanding of the next level of the game is understanding the aggregate economic patterns that are developing at the table. So understanding the table's economy, so to speak, with the races that are being played and number of players.

I can see that at high player counts that would be impossible in general, but I could see making some strategic plays in my trades and investments based on the composition of the table and the techs people are driving for at 5 or 6 players.
Sagrilarus's Avatar
Sagrilarus replied the topic: #302104 30 Sep 2019 23:29
The ad copy almost sounds like an apology for the 1st version's rule book. Was it that bad?
Gary Sax's Avatar
Gary Sax replied the topic: #302106 01 Oct 2019 01:54
That's the weird thing, not at all. I think you could beef with the graphic design and such, but the rules never struck me as bad at all. I found that bit very surprising.
jeb's Avatar
jeb replied the topic: #302149 02 Oct 2019 17:27
the 1e rules are SO bad

I learned how to play ARKHAM HORROR by my damn self and I cannot being to penetrate the SIDEREAL CONFLUENCE rules. Some of the absolute worst rules I have seen in the modern era.
Shellhead's Avatar
Shellhead replied the topic: #302153 02 Oct 2019 18:23
I have never played Sidereal Confluence, but I have played many games of Pit. It seems like Sidereal Confluence would be a real headache to play, due to the combination of variable powers, bidding, engine-building, and real-time trading. Information overload plus a frantic pace.
Gary Sax's Avatar
Gary Sax replied the topic: #302156 02 Oct 2019 20:15

jeb wrote: the 1e rules are SO bad

I learned how to play ARKHAM HORROR by my damn self and I cannot being to penetrate the SIDEREAL CONFLUENCE rules. Some of the absolute worst rules I have seen in the modern era.


This is really interesting, I had no real problems with them so I was wondering why they were selling the rules update so hard.
Gary Sax's Avatar
Gary Sax replied the topic: #302166 03 Oct 2019 09:48
I think about this game a lot. I need a game group in my current town. I should *gulp* meet some randos at the public game night.
Gary Sax's Avatar
Gary Sax replied the topic: #311868 10 Jul 2020 13:22
spacebiff.com/2020/07/09/sbbs-6-tauceti-deichmann/

An interesting interview with the designer here, listened to it while doing something else, though the designer seems pretty nervous. This game is at the top of my want-to-play toad list now that John Company has gotten a bunch of TTS play (wooo!).

I'm always amazed how much this game actually has lore and thematic grounding that are not present in the game.
jeb's Avatar
jeb replied the topic: #311878 10 Jul 2020 17:19
I hope the scoring is fixed. It's so bizarre. During the game, you're instructed that these items are of largely equivalent value:
3 small cubes =
2 large cubes =
1 octagon

It's a helpful way to think about trades. Obviously, during the game, colors matter, as do ships (worth 1 small cube). You're also accumulating Victory Points for doing various things, and at game end, those above ratios are used to generate HALF Victory Points. That is, 3 small cubes is worth one HALF of a Victory Point.

Why do this? Why add this? It strikes me as so bizarre. Can't we think of each small cube as 1/6 of a VP and rescale them?
1 small cube = 1 ship = 2 VP.
1 large cube = 3 VPs.
1 octagon = 6 VPs.
1 (old)VP = 12 VPs.

Maintains all the ratios, and I don't need to do frog fractions to figure out what stuff is worth. Don't need to think about what happens when I have 7 small cubes and ships at the end game (is this 1 1/6 pts? Do we round?) I think Deichmann is trying to capture the idea of invested capital vs cash reserves here, but it's really gilding the lily.
Gary Sax's Avatar
Gary Sax replied the topic: #311880 10 Jul 2020 17:33
Everything pretty much unchanged, with newly updated visuals and new rulebooks.
OhBollox's Avatar
OhBollox replied the topic: #311906 11 Jul 2020 07:55
Honestly tempted, but I like the 1e fine. Absolutely had no idea what people were talking about concerning complaints with the game's looks.
hotseatgames's Avatar
hotseatgames replied the topic: #311911 11 Jul 2020 12:06
I've always wanted to try this one, but it doesn't fit my group. I'd love to try it on TTS with people here though.
Gary Sax's Avatar
Gary Sax replied the topic: #311913 11 Jul 2020 12:59
It would be a big challenge (multiple chat rooms for trading probably, bit longer timer) but I'd def be enthused to try, hotseat.
hotseatgames's Avatar
hotseatgames replied the topic: #311914 11 Jul 2020 13:00
That was my concern... this one has a reputation of being long in real life. It might be really insufferable online.
Gary Sax's Avatar
Gary Sax replied the topic: #311916 11 Jul 2020 13:09
We can set timers for the rounds tightish, then we'll have a concrete target for time. Sacrifice game decision quality, but I don't give a fuck. Supposedly everybody's first game of this sucks strategywise anyway so might as well get it out of the way.

I'll raise a flag in the TTS thread too, we need 2 more intrepid players.
Ah_Pook's Avatar
Ah_Pook replied the topic: #311923 11 Jul 2020 18:09
I think this game would be a complete nightmare on TTS, having played it IRL. Everyone talking over each other constantly would be awful enough, and then trying to handle the amount of cards and cubes you play with in real time, and trying to keep track of everyone's cards and cubes in real time so you can make deals... I dunno. I'm curious to hear back if y'all do it though :)
Gary Sax's Avatar
Gary Sax replied the topic: #311927 11 Jul 2020 18:54
I think you would really need to play with multiple discords channels (1-3 maybe?) in addition to a general one open and invite people into them. it would be awkward, though, for sure. I'd still try it with a solid timer but then I'm very desperate to play this thing.